[Newsbot]

Title: Beijing pollution hits extremely hazardous levels
Category: Health
Posted By: ShepherdsDog
Date: 2015-11-30 14:02:03

[N_Fiddledog]

But wait...how is this possible?

In the lead up to the Paris climate scare convention our "climate change" experts here at CKA have been telling us China is leading the world in alternative energy.

Something is puzzling about that equation. Isn't this "alternative energy" of which they speak supposed to lessen pollution? Is there something worse than "extremely hazardous" that it's lessening from. . If not I don't understand.

[BeaverFever]

It is a leader in renewable energy. That doesn't mean it doesn't have pollution.

For example, Canada is a leader in education and yet we still have you.

[N_Fiddledog]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

It is a leader in renewable energy. That doesn't mean it doesn't have pollution.

For example, Canada is a leader in education and yet we still have you.

Why do you assume you know where I was educated? For the same reason you believe in all this Chinese clean energy? If you want to believe a thing it becomes true, does it?

And anybody who doesn't think so is a big, fat, stoopid head, right?

[N_Fiddledog]

Here, watch. I'll show you the reality based way to answer your question.

First of all notice you said "renewable". I said "clean".

I did that purposefully, because you would like to imply one is the same thing as the other. It's not.

China should lead the world in renewables. First of all it can flood giant valleys for hydro-electric and nobody who wants to remain out of prison or alive is going to bitch.

Try flooding a valley here though.

China holds the bulk of the earth's rare earth metals. Rare earth metals are necessary for the tech that creates wind and solar. You want to talk environmental disasters though forget about what you call the 'tar sands' visit a rare earth metal pit.

China's greatest resource might be cheap labor, so it is not just making wind and solar gizmos for itself, it manufactures for the world. Would you like to pretend that's done with your "renewable energy"?

China relies on coal for two thirds of its total energy production.

As you know (or should) wind and solar may be renewable, but they are not necessarily clean. For one thing they must rely on fossil fuels to remain operational when wind or solar are not possible. In China at present that means coal.

They also must rely on subsidies and apparently the Chinese are beginning to run out of those.

There is help on the way. They are fracking and they have just signed a massive deal with Russia for Natural Gas. Natural Gas burns cleaner than coal. It is therefore possible that in the near future they may get both renewables to make people like you happy, and a little cleaner to satisfy true environmentalists like myself.

[desertdude]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

For example, Canada is a leader in education and yet we still have you.

[DrCaleb]

desertdude desertdude:

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

For example, Canada is a leader in education and yet we still have you.

You'll never convince an extremest that there is a middle ground, BF. There is only their view, and the extreme opposite. Nothing in between.

"Beware that, when fighting monsters, you yourself do not become a monster... for when you gaze long into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.” ― Friedrich Nietzsche

[Thanos]

Any chance we can blame this all on HAAAAAAAAAARRRRPPPPPER!, because that would be like really nifty.

[BartSimpson]

The pollution in Beijing is obviously Bush's fault because when Obama got elected was the moment when the planet began to heal.

[Thanos]

Healing through all the good vibes of a perpetual non-stop smug alert.

[BeaverFever]

$1:

Why do you assume you know where I was educated?

I don't know if you've ever been outside of Canada or not but either way I'm certain you weren't educated in Canada.

As for tho whole rest of your diatribe, I'm not here to promote China but your premise is just so annoying it doesn't deserve to stand unchallenged.

The following was reported by Forbes in June 2014:

Jun 17, 2014 @ 09:09 AM 19,388 views
China Leads In Renewable Investment -- Again!

- 61 % of all renewable energy investment comes from china, more than all of europe
- China has increased its investment in renewables nearly every year for the past ten years.
- China is now home to about 24 percent of the world’s renewable power capacity


http://www.forbes.com/sites/jackperkows ... ent-again/

$1:

China should be given more credit for its investment in clean electricity, the head of the International Energy Agency says.

Maria van der Hoeven says most people think that China is frantically building coal-fired power stations.

The reality, she says, is that China is spending as much as the US and Europe put together on clean power.

She says its coal-fired power stations are state of the art - and should be copied in other developing countries.

Maria van der Hoeven told BBC News: "People think about China in a way more representative of previous decades.

"They are now the largest wind power market in the world. They have increased their power generation from renewables from really nothing 10 years ago - and now it's 25%. These are very important signals that China is moving into the right direction

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-33143176

Many other similar articles are out there, both old and new. Nowhere does this say that being a green energy leader suddenly means you have no more pollution. Note that leading the world in growth of green energy power plants and related investment doesn't mean that China is now primarily powered by green energy, nor does it mean that China's pollution only came from power plants anyway, as opposed to cars, factories, etc. Anyone except except you would understand that.

[N_Fiddledog]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

As for tho whole rest of your diatribe, I'm not here to promote China but your premise is just so annoying it doesn't deserve to stand unchallenged.

The following was reported by Forbes in June 2014:

Jun 17, 2014 @ 09:09 AM 19,388 views
China Leads In Renewable Investment -- Again!

What you seem to have missed from my diatribe is the clearly stated facts. Also the main point. The main point was "renewable" does not mean "clean". There's an insinuation it does, but it doesn't.

Let's go through your hysterical counterpoint to show how you missed that.

$1:

- 61 % of all renewable energy investment comes from china, more than all of europe

Yes. And I explained why. China has an advantage in labour and accessibility to essential rare earth metals. However the environmental damage caused by mining rare earth metals and the coal energy expended to serve the world its inefficient alternatives to fossil fuels is massive and dirty. The last I heard 2/3s of china's energy still came from coal.

$1:

- China has increased its investment in renewables nearly every year for the past ten years.

Yes, but if you clicked the link I gave you, you would have learned China is starting to run out of funds to subsidize alternatives. They require subsidies - even in china.

$1:

- China is now home to about 24 percent of the world’s renewable power capacity

Yes, but re-emphasizing China's movement to things like wind, and solar does not make China's environment any cleaner. I'll say it one more time, so both you and the BBC can hear it - "Renewable" and environmentally clean are not necessarily the same thing.

Although there was one thing from your BBC article that is worth reiterating. I'd like Thanos to hear it. Modern western technology has shown China how to create coal energy in an environmentally cleaner manner. It is now possible to separate and contain many of the actual pollutants that were once discharged in the process. Cleaner coal is not the same thing as "clean coal". When you use the term "clean coal" you are implying a process that separates and contains all carbon dioxide. And yes Thanos, at this point that does not appear possible. Much cleaner coal however is not only possible, it's done everyday. The Chinese are starting to learn how to do it. We taught them.

They are also moving towards cleaner burning natural gas which will help them clean the air.

Manufacturing for the world's experiments in alternative energy however - not so much. All that is only making China dirtier.

And BTW Beave if you're going to keep insisting on this humorous implication of your superior intelligence would it be too much to request you produce some evidence of it in the future. Because we haven't seen it yet.