[Newsbot]

Title: GO Transit wind turbine producing 91% less power than expected
Category: Business
Posted By: N_Fiddledog
Date: 2015-11-01 10:36:17
Canadian

[N_Fiddledog]

Or to put it another way:



http://ontario-wind-resistance.org/2015 ... projected/

[fifeboy]

So...are you saying we should quit trying...

[ShepherdsDog]

Invest more into proven sources that have minimal greenhouse impact, but have proven cost effective....LNG fueled power plants, hydro and even nuclear.

[N_Fiddledog]

Exactly.

In fact, what, if anything are these guys saying that is incorrect?

http://www.windontario.ca/

$1:

* Ontario has the most expensive electricity in North America

*Over the next 20 years, your household will pay an additional $40,000 for electricity.

* Ontario is building 7700 Wind Turbines. (as of August 2015)

* We have clean and excess power from water, nuclear and gas.

* Nuclear, hydro, & gas is clean, cheap and has a 100% reliability, but wind (with 20-30% reliability) is given priority to our grid.

* For every kwh of wind power, we need one kwh of backup, that could otherwise be used as our sole source.

* Ontario has too much power and we either, pay the USA & Quebec to get rid of the excess or charge 1-3 cents per kwh.

* From 2005 to 2012, the loss was $1.8 billion.

*In 2013, the loss was $1 billion.

* In October 2014 alone, Ontario paid $1 billion over market price for energy resulting in an immediate increase in hydro rates,

Quebec turns around and sells our hydro at 5 cents per kwh to bordering States.
When there is too much power, Ontario pays $1 million dollars a day to take a nuclear plant off-line and pays wind companies to shut down their turbines.
$6 billion was spent to increase the power at Niagara Falls; only to divert the water when there is excess power.

* Ontario pays gas plants to run as backup for wind power.
September 11, 2013: Ontario agreed to pay Wind Energy companies $200,000 per mw not to supply power,


* The plan to build two new nuclear reactors at Darlington was abruptly cancelled in October 2013 at a cost of $180 million.

* During the 2011 election, the Liberals cancelled the construction of 2 gas plants to win Liberal seats at a cost of $1.1 billion.

* Ontario has the highest industrial rates in North America

* We pay more for wind power than any province/state in North America.
We are subsidizing the wind industry.
Ontario is the only province/state that charges HST, delivery, and regulatory fees on electricity.

http://www.windontario.ca/

I'm not sure about that last one. What's that about?

But however they're calculating it surprised me.

$1:

Hydro Rates by Province for 1000 kWh (May 2015)

British Columbia: $84.12

Basic monthly charge, 0.16640 per day ($4.92 monthly)
Energy Charge: 7.52¢/kWh x1000, $75.20
Rate Rider 5% Rate Rider applied to all charges before taxes and levies 4.92+75.2= 80.12 + $4 (rate rider)

Ontario: $192.33 + HST = $217.33

20% on peak hours, 20% on mid peak, 60% on low peak is the average
200 kwh peak,$32.2, 200 mid, $22.8, 600 low, $42, Total $97
Line loss charge + $11.19
Basic Monthly Charge + $24.07
Smart meter entity charge + $0.79
Debt retirement + $7
Regulatory charge + $5.95
Delivery charge + $46.33
(distribution charge, $33.90, + transmission connection,+ $4.99, + transmission network + $7.19, + smart meter entity charge, 25 cents)

I thought BC would be right up there with you.

[OnTheIce]

Ontarians don't care. The Ontario Liberals know best.

Premier Mom, who replaced Premier Dad know best. They are doing what's best for Ontario and that's why we gave them a huge majority.

[herbie]

Computer store I used to run in BC had an Internet cafe in the front and a server rack in the back and I bitched paying $450 every 2 mos.
At home I pay about $100 a month and grumble. Replaced every bulb in the house with CFLs when I first bought it and saw a $10 drop, now we're going LED. The kitchen/dining room is lit with only 54W now, less than one incandescent.I don't know how Ontario can justify such rates, but you have to be retarded to have any old style incandescent bulbs in your houses there.

[romanP]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Invest more into proven sources that have minimal greenhouse impact, but have proven cost effective....LNG fueled power plants, hydro and even nuclear.

greenhouse gasses aren't the only environmental problem we're causing. all of those have serious detrimental effects on the environment, mostly land and water pollution.

[Freakinoldguy]

herbie herbie:

Computer store I used to run in BC had an Internet cafe in the front and a server rack in the back and I bitched paying $450 every 2 mos.
At home I pay about $100 a month and grumble. Replaced every bulb in the house with CFLs when I first bought it and saw a $10 drop, now we're going LED. The kitchen/dining room is lit with only 54W now, less than one incandescent.I don't know how Ontario can justify such rates, but you have to be retarded to have any old style incandescent bulbs in your houses there.

For alot of people it's the heat not the lights. All homes are effected but back in the 70's and 80's due to cheap electricity they built a shitload of houses with electric baseboard heat which, has developed over the years due to hydro increases into a costly method of heating a home.

So, since there is no cost effective way to retrofit those homes to other methods of heating without tearing out alot of the interior reframing and running ductwork, those people are pretty much stuck with the windfall of ungodly high hydro rates as a gift from Chairman McGuinty and his Green Queen Kathleen with their save the planet singlehandedly, fuck your constituents philosophy.

[herbie]

I know, my last home here was rural and used to have two hydro meters, back in the 80s and 90s you paid a reduced rate for electric heating. Everyone also had wood furnaces.
They finally brought in gas and amazingly, within 2 years that was way more than hydro used to be. To top it off, the insurers went nutzoid on anything wood - $2500-$5000 yearly increase in home insurance if you even had it!
So some people put wood furnaces in outbuildings and piped the heat. Within a couple years nsurers demanded it be 100 ft away (who's got a lot that big? How can it travel that far if its 35 below?)...
They're getting even now, many of the old neighbours have solar banks and small wind turbines or even those ground-heat systems.
AFAIK BCs still an exporter of hydro and I'm not joining the anti-SiteC crowd. Still of the opinion its better than the alternatives.

[andyt]

We'll need it since Vancouver plans to be totally carbon free by 2050. Ie electric cars and electric heating.

But I've heard some pretty good arguments that it would make a lot more sense to build some gas fired generator plants instead of site C. Site C seems to mostly be a sop to the lng for export crowd, which seems to be fading by the day.

[BartSimpson]

herbie herbie:

Computer store I used to run in BC had an Internet cafe in the front and a server rack in the back and I bitched paying $450 every 2 mos.
At home I pay about $100 a month and grumble. Replaced every bulb in the house with CFLs when I first bought it and saw a $10 drop, now we're going LED. The kitchen/dining room is lit with only 54W now, less than one incandescent.I don't know how Ontario can justify such rates, but you have to be retarded to have any old style incandescent bulbs in your houses there.

I live in Sacramento and our electric provider is SMUD. SMUD mostly uses its own hydro power but also has contracts with coal-burning plants in Nevada and Arizona.

My highest monthly bill this year was in July when we needed to have the air conditioner on a lot.

It was $63.16.

The bill for September was $38.83

Our electricity isn't any less special than yours so I don't see why you're paying so much other than liberals.

[Freakinoldguy]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

herbie herbie:

Computer store I used to run in BC had an Internet cafe in the front and a server rack in the back and I bitched paying $450 every 2 mos.
At home I pay about $100 a month and grumble. Replaced every bulb in the house with CFLs when I first bought it and saw a $10 drop, now we're going LED. The kitchen/dining room is lit with only 54W now, less than one incandescent.I don't know how Ontario can justify such rates, but you have to be retarded to have any old style incandescent bulbs in your houses there.

I live in Sacramento and our electric provider is SMUD. SMUD mostly uses its own hydro power but also has contracts with coal-burning plants in Nevada and Arizona.

My highest monthly bill this year was in July when we needed to have the air conditioner on a lot.

It was $63.16.

The bill for September was $38.83

Our electricity isn't any less special than yours so I don't see why you're paying so much other than liberals.

They're doing major infrastructure upgrades and need to pass the cost on to consumers.

But, to be fair they and previous gov'ts can't explain where all the profits from 60 years of hydro rates have disappeared to so, we should be giving them a break.

In essence we're paying a high hydro rate because we've been ass raped by successive governments who, instead of robbing the Corporation should have been putting the money back into infrastructure.

Or, maybe they're trying to recoup the nearly billion Powerex will have to pay out for teaming up with California Energy Providers like Enron and ass raping you guys back in the day. Although to be fair that's something that is never mentioned or even brought up by our beloved leaders

$1:

Powerex will pay $273 million US in cash and offer California electric utilities a credit worth $477 million US to settle claims against it related to allegations that it helped inflate the California power market during that state's electricity market crisis of 2000 and 2001

http://www.vancouversun.com/technology/ ... =72e5-ddaa

At least our Liberals haven't completely lost their minds yet and decided tidal power or some other such bullshit is the way to go. So despite the fact the consumers will have to pay at least we're better off than Ontario (so far)

[Thanos]

Canadian utility rates are special because we're a special people. At least two thirds of our rates are split between privatization pirates and the general happy fund we have for all our big bleeding hearts projects. Either that or we're just stupid and too gutless to do anything about these kinds of rip offs. It's pretty much what Canadian exceptionalism consists of.