[Newsbot]

Title: RCMP show dramatic security video of gunman behind Ottawa shootings
Category: Misc CDN
Posted By: Hyack
Date: 2014-10-23 14:38:45
Canadian

[DrCaleb]

Winchester 30/30. If I were to use any civillian rifle in this manner, it would be that one. Powerful, compact, accurate. I'd never dream of doing such a athing of course, but that would be the last rifle banned ever. Lever action, unalterable magazine. A near perfect hunting rifle and anything that can hunt deer can hunt people.

[Hyack]

Only in Canada you say......

It would seem we have been burdened with 2nd or 3rd class terrorists who don't even have the funding or resources to supply them with the "appropriate" firearms....

[ShepherdsDog]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Winchester 30/30. If I were to use any civillian rifle in this manner, it would be that one. Powerful, compact, accurate. I'd never dream of doing such a athing of course, but that would be the last rifle banned ever. Lever action, unalterable magazine. A near perfect hunting rifle and anything that can hunt deer can hunt people.

Guess they'll have to ban bows then, because they can take down things a lot larger than a man.

[DrCaleb]

Holy crap! I would not have waited so long so shoot it. Those things can f- you up!

[andyt]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Winchester 30/30. If I were to use any civillian rifle in this manner, it would be that one. Powerful, compact, accurate. I'd never dream of doing such a athing of course, but that would be the last rifle banned ever. Lever action, unalterable magazine. A near perfect hunting rifle and anything that can hunt deer can hunt people.

I understand that it can't take a scope, so is losing popularity. But then they said the 30/30 isn't very powerful compared to what else is out there. That surprised me.

But it sure wouldn't be the one to create max havoc. A semi-auto with magazine loading would have meant he could have killed both soldiers without worrying about running out of bullets, slapped in another mag and been much deadlier in Parliament as well, which is why I say ban the semi-autos. If the Winchester is the near perfect hunting rifle, and people say they own rifles for hunting, well there you go. A ban on semi-autos shouldn't hurt hunters at all.

Last report I heard was that he stole this rifle from his aunt. Thank God this guy didn't have access to a deadlier weapon and didn't know what he was doing. With a mag loaded semi-auto he could have sprayed a lot more death around. He passed right by the caucus rooms of the CPC and NDP, with the MPs inside, including Harper. When he was trying to hide from security behind a pillar, Vickers knew his position because the rifle was sticking out.

[DrCaleb]

andyt andyt:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Winchester 30/30. If I were to use any civillian rifle in this manner, it would be that one. Powerful, compact, accurate. I'd never dream of doing such a athing of course, but that would be the last rifle banned ever. Lever action, unalterable magazine. A near perfect hunting rifle and anything that can hunt deer can hunt people.

I understand that it can't take a scope, so is losing popularity. But then they said the 30/30 isn't very powerful compared to what else is out there. That surprised me.

Who is 'they'? The 30/30 is a pretty powerful rifle. Here's a pic of the cartridge, on the left. The center is a NATO 5.56 X 45 and the right is a 7.62 X 51.

andyt andyt:

But it sure wouldn't be the one to create max havoc. A semi-auto with magazine loading would have meant he could have killed both soldiers without worrying about running out of bullets, slapped in another mag and been much deadlier in Parliament as well, which is why I say ban the semi-autos.

I say enough with the knee jerk reactions. He could also have driven his car on the lawn and killed all sorts of people, I say as a irrational reaction, that we ban cars.

andyt andyt:

If the Winchester is the near perfect hunting rifle, and people say they own rifles for hunting, well there you go. A ban on semi-autos shouldn't hurt hunters at all.

The reason AR-15s were 'restricted' rather than outright banned is because they are used in shooting competitions. Olympic events also include semi-auto rifles.

And the 30/30 is a good hunting rifle not because of it's firing action, it's because it is short and well built to handle getting knocked around and dirty in the bush.

andyt andyt:

Last report I heard was that he stole this rifle from his aunt. Thank God this guy didn't have access to a deadlier weapon and didn't know what he was doing. With a mag loaded semi-auto he could have sprayed a lot more death around. He passed right by the caucus rooms of the CPC and NDP, with the MPs inside, including Harper. When he was trying to hide from security behind a pillar, Vickers knew his position because the rifle was sticking out.

Ahhhh! Panic! Aahhhhh! Spraying death! Ahhhhh! Ban all guns! Aaaaaa!

Or we can see that the system worked and he wasn't allowed to buy the big scary gun, nor could he obtain one illegally. He apparently had lots of money from working in the oilsands, so that was no barrier.

[andyt]

OK, i'll meet you half way. If the AR 15 is restricted, lets restrict all semi-autos, so that only the competitors are legally allowed to own them. Although why a competitor would need semi-auto is beyond me. Seems that would be the occasion where you really can take the most time to reload. They have competitions with muzzle loaders too, doesn't seem to bother them any.

The system didn't work, since he got his hands on a weapon he was not allowed to possess. Somebody was careless with that gun, so it would be stolen in the first place. The fewer legal guns there are, the fewer are available for stealing. I say up the penalty for careless storage of a firearm and make the requirements for safer storage more stringent. (I can just hear the farmers now: "Ah, gots to have ma rafle by my bedside in case I hears a varmit at night that needs shootin. Yu up")

[DrCaleb]

andyt andyt:

OK, i'll meet you half way. If the AR 15 is restricted, lets restrict all semi-autos, so that only the competitors are legally allowed to own them.

Since there is no shooting rampage by AR-15 owners, how about we just let them keep owning the legally registered firearms they already own? And the only reason it's 'restricted' is the way it looks. There are other rifles with the same specs that are not restricted. How about we reward these responsible owners by relaxing the restrictions they have in participating in their chosen sport?

andyt andyt:

Although why a competitor would need semi-auto is beyond me. Seems that would be the occasion where you really can take the most time to reload. They have competitions with muzzle loaders too, doesn't seem to bother them any.

Taking your aim away from a target reduces your accuracy. That is also the point of blackpowder competitions.

andyt andyt:

The system didn't work, since he got his hands on a weapon he was not allowed to possess. Somebody was careless with that gun, so it would be stolen in the first place.

Ahh, yes! Time for 'let's blame the gun!'.

andyt andyt:

The fewer legal guns there are, the fewer are available for stealing.

And the higher the price on the black market.

andyt andyt:

I say up the penalty for careless storage of a firearm and make the requirements for safer storage more stringent. (I can just hear the farmers now: "Ah, gots to have ma rafle by my bedside in case I hears a varmit at night that needs shootin. Yu up")

Ok, so ridiculous stereotypes aside, how will that prevent people from stealing rifles when they aren't allowed to steal rifles now?

[andyt]

As I said, make the requirements for safe storage stricter.

Higher price guns on the black market = good.

I was blaming whoever legally owned the gun and didn't prevent it from being stolen.

If every competitor has to take his aim away from target to reload, everybody is equal. BTW your fellow gun nuts on this forum argue that a bolt action rifle is just as effective as a semi-auto. They don't seem to hold no truck with your idea.

MY first point was to treat all semi-autos the way AR15's are treated now. If I understand you right, the competitors can still get their hands on them, and otherwise I haven't seen any indication of Canada being worse off for that weapon being restricted.

[BartSimpson]

Andy, your ignorance is showing again.

[DrCaleb]

andyt andyt:

MY first point was to treat all semi-autos the way AR15's are treated now. If I understand you right, the competitors can still get their hands on them, and otherwise I haven't seen any indication of Canada being worse off for that weapon being restricted.

And my point is that Canadians are free from the arbitrary seizure of their assets, according to the constitution.

And if a bolt action is the same as an AR-15, why not restrict bolt actions as well? How about pump shotguns, they are pretty close to bolt actions, right?

Imagine if hockey players had to jump through the hoops that competition shooters have to.

Round and round we go, same old discussion, no new solutions.

[andyt]

They're not the same, as you yourself admitted.

Canadians are not immune to the seizure of illegally owned assets. In fact even legally owned assets can be seized with fair compensation.

[DrCaleb]

andyt andyt:

They're not the same, as you yourself admitted.

Canadians are not immune to the seizure of illegally owned assets. In fact even legally owned assets can be seized with fair compensation.

Incorrect. There are still people out there who own fully automatic weapons. They could not be seized, because they were legally acquired.

[andyt]

Alright. At least nobody would be acquiring new ones. I bet if the govt was willing to pay for those weapons tho, they could be expropriated with no legal challenge. We don't have property rights in Canada, thanks to that commie Trudeau.