[DerbyX]

ridenrain ridenrain:

Derby: The last government was the losngest lasting of any minority government in the history of Canada. This was entierly thanks to Dion abstaining from votes more than any opposition leader in the history of Canada.

You're party is becomming irrelivent.


Thanos: The Libs and the Bloc are 2 sides of the same coin and one can't live without the other. It's a good cop/bad cop routine to beat money out of Canadian taxpayers.

So what? Under Trudeau and Chretien we had the longest sitting governments of our time.

If any party was irrelevant it was you cons.

The Libs obviously aren't irrelevant as they formed the official opposition.

You just can't admit that Harper is playing the very political games you decried in the libs just as you can't admit Harper went a running when the threat of a coalition sprung up.

[ridenrain]

You ignore the fact that this was a minority. Dion and the Liberals were the ones who made it amajority because they didn't have the guts or the funding to stand up for what they said. Now we see the Libs jump into bed with the folks who want to tear Canada apart, just so they can keep their welfare checks.

More underhanded than Chretien's snap election against an unprepaired Day in 2002? That A-hole kinsella hauled out every slander he could in a grotesque copy of US politics, and you sheep lapped it right up.

Suck it up. To you it's a plus and to me it's a negative so don't cry when it flips 180 degrees.

[StuntmanMike]

Harper unintentionally created a crisis through his pig-headed attempt to emasculate the Liberals with his election financing reforms. That created an impetus for a coalition, and come December 8th, it looks like we might be facing one.

I think it'll be a disaster. I don't think the NDP and Libs have enough in common to pull it off. We had an NDP/Lib coalition in the 70's. That was under a strong leader in Trudeau, and back then the government's survival didn't hinge on the support of an avowed separatist party.

Even that was unworkable.

That's a terrible scenario in today's economic environment.

Personally, I think after the coalition implodes, it'll leave the Conservatives in a stronger position than they were in before.

[Thanos]

$1:

Thanos: The Libs and the Bloc are 2 sides of the same coin and one can't live without the other. It's a good cop/bad cop routine to beat money out of Canadian taxpayers.

Chretien probably thought that the Bloc would be useful to the Liberals on occasions such as this, but even as big a pervert as Chretien was I doubt that he'd have risked making them the power-broker behind the scenes. You said that the Liberals are becoming irrelevant. True enough, but this display of the past week shows how truly dangerous some people will become once they realize their irrelevancy.

A coalition of federalist opposition parties I would have to grudgingly accept. A coalition including, or being propped up by a separatist party has to be, by definition, morally and ethically unacceptable to every person who considers themselves a Canadian nationalist or federalist. That it does not appear to be so, as evidenced by this forum site, can quite easily lead to a tragedy of unknown and potentially unbeleivable proportions. The rational side of me cannot accept this and this is why I'm fighting it with such vigour.

[Pimpbrewski]

To be fair Thanos, I can see your point, but it seems there is a bit resentment.

But at the same time, this might all be a big bluff. There is no concrete evidence that they will even pull this through. But then again, am no expert here.

Although, you are right. The Bloc should not even be involved. Heck, I have previously stated that the Bloc should be dissolved for it doesn't belong at the Federal level. At least, you had the decency to differentiate a separatist party from an entire province.

[DerbyX]

ridenrain ridenrain:

You ignore the fact that this was a minority. Dion and the Liberals were the ones who made it amajority because they didn't have the guts or the funding to stand up for what they said. Now we see the Libs jump into bed with the folks who want to tear Canada apart, just so they can keep their welfare checks.

More underhanded than Chretien's snap election against an unprepaired Day in 2002? That A-hole kinsella hauled out every slander he could in a grotesque copy of US politics, and you sheep lapped it right up.

Suck it up. To you it's a plus and to me it's a negative so don't cry when it flips 180 degrees.

No, you are ignoring the fact that Harper negotiated with the Boc when it suited him.

You ignore that its his responsibility to make parliment work and he tried to circumvent that.

You ignore Harper broke his own etched in stone election law for partisan gain and has done everything and absolutely everything you decried the Libs did.

If and when the opposition parties form a colaition then you will suck it up knowing full well that it was entirely of Harpers design.

Unlucky.

[ridenrain]

Thanos: I agree. One can only shudder to think of the buy-outs and aid that these splitters would demand for their support. Ot begs the question why a party dedicated to the seperation of canada was ever allowed in the first place, and that's why I have to keep thinking that this is just a Liberal made boogy-man.

Stuntman: You call it pig headed.. Im calling it a skewer, after the move in chess. By careful moves, you place two enemy in danger and force him to make the best of a bad situation. This would be killer if they had the media on their side but it's still a damning fact.

[DerbyX]

The kool-aid is strong in this one.

[Thanos]

$1:

To be fair Thanos, I can see your point, but it seems there is a bit resentment.

But at the same time, this might all be a big bluff. There is no concrete evidence that they will even pull this through. But then again, am no expert here.

Although, you are right. The Bloc should not even be involved. Heck, I have previously stated that the Bloc should be dissolved for it doesn't belong at the Federal level.

I'm hoping that the GG can deny the application for a coalition due to the fact that the coalition is existentially not possible without acknowledging Bloc support. This should then logically lead to the GG rejecting the formation of a Liberal/NDP/Bloc government based on the undeniable fact that the Bloc is anathema to Canadian federalism and therefore cannot legally be allowed to become part of a federal government that has to govern the entire country, either as a recognized and official governing partner or as a "hidden" backstage actor holding the balance of power.

$1:

At least, you had the decency to differentiate a separatist party from an entire province.

I did say some things on the Quebec natives separation thread that I should take back then before you compliment me. My only defense is it was said in the heat of anger and apprehension.

[ridenrain]

DerbyX DerbyX:

The kool-aid is strong in this one.

Stop stealing my lines, you partisan hack.

[StuntmanMike]

Thanos Thanos:

$1:

A coalition of federalist opposition parties I would have to grudgingly accept. A coalition including, or being propped up by a separatist party has to be, by definition, morally and ethically unacceptable to every person who considers themselves a Canadian nationalist or federalist. That it does not appear to be so, as evidenced by this forum site, can quite easily lead to a tragedy of unknown and potentially unbeleivable proportions. The rational side of me cannot accept this and this is why I'm fighting it with such vigour.

Thanos, no offence but you need to take a deep, long breath and relax a bit.

While I agree, that a coalition government is the last thing this country needs at the moment, it's not the end of the world. We've had them before.

It occurred during WW1 over conscription, another time when this country didn't need political instability. Yet we survived.

We had one following the Byng/Mackenzie affair. The country survived.

We had an NDP Liberal coalition in 1972. It lasted two years, until Trudeau determined the polls were in his favour and dissolved it.

And Ontario had an NDP/Lib coalition from 1985 to 1990.

It's not the end of the world.

[DerbyX]

Paraphrased from George Lucas anyway. I wouldn't be surprised if even inferences were copywrited,

[romanP]

Thanos Thanos:

You negate my vote in an election and then expect me to sit back in silence and just take it?

How is your vote negated? The Conservatives would still form part of the government, they would just be put back where they belong, in the opposition seating. You may have conveniently forgotten that they still hold a minority of seats, while the majority of voters chose the other four parties.

[StuntmanMike]

DerbyX DerbyX:

If and when the opposition parties form a colaition then you will suck it up knowing full well that it was entirely of Harpers design.

Unlucky.

It was Harper's fault. And it's unfortunate.

But if you think this is going to be a walk in the park for the Libs, you're crazy. Former Ontario Premier David Peterson was on The National tonight explaining how difficult it was for him to govern Ontario in the 80's with a Liberal/NDP coalition. And he didn't have the difficulty of a shit economy, third wheel separatist party, or flagging personal leadership support to deal with.

Good luck running Canada on that framework.

[Thanos]

StuntmanMike StuntmanMike:

Thanos Thanos:

$1:

A coalition of federalist opposition parties I would have to grudgingly accept. A coalition including, or being propped up by a separatist party has to be, by definition, morally and ethically unacceptable to every person who considers themselves a Canadian nationalist or federalist. That it does not appear to be so, as evidenced by this forum site, can quite easily lead to a tragedy of unknown and potentially unbeleivable proportions. The rational side of me cannot accept this and this is why I'm fighting it with such vigour.

Thanos, no offence but you need to take a deep, long breath and relax a bit.

While I agree, that a coalition government is the last thing this country needs at the moment, it's not the end of the world. We've had them before.

It occurred during WW1 over conscription, another time when this country didn't need political instability. Yet we survived.

We had one following the Byng/Mackenzie affair. The country survived.

We had an NDP Liberal coalition in 1972. It lasted two years, until Trudeau determined the polls were in his favour and dissolved it.

And Ontario had an NDP/Lib coalition from 1985 to 1990.

It's not the end of the world.

None of those instances included anyone prostituting themselves to the worst pimp on the BLOC though. My intuition is telling me that this one has all kinds of genuine badness written all over it. This episode isn't the beginning of the next chapter of the end but instead could be the spasm that sets off the beginning of the end.

Government policy influenced or, more likely, directly written by Gilles Duceppe and his rotten separatist cohorts. I don't see how this possibility doesn't literally terrorize the shit out of anyone who's been paying attention to this issue.