[DerbyX]

We have Harper to prove it. He himself pointed out that both parties would have enacted various taxes, either carbon taxes, GST hikes, or corporate tax increases. In addition he says that under either government we would not have gotten the tax decreases he gave us.

Its simple logic that if both parties had measures to increase taxes then both parties would not be this deep in debt.

[ASLplease]

So what kind of a tax increase would it take to cough up $172 billion? I am interested in seeing if their tax measures would have been enough

[DerbyX]

172 billion over 5 years would be a lot less with our original 7% GST. An increase in personal tax, EI premiums, corporate tax. Anything is better then a massive deficit.

[Proculation]

DerbyX DerbyX:

The difference is that neither the Libs or the NDP would be in this deep and had either one of them been in charge then none of the people currently giving Harper the big pass would find this deficit acceptable. This forum would consist on nothing but attack threads decrying the tax and spend leftists philosophy and proclaiming to all that a conservative government would never have done this. Much like they did before, during, and just after the last election.

This is partisanery. Want it or not, the libs would have quite the same and the NDP would have nationalized all industries in difficulty. We are in a recession and they are Keynesians and socialists. 1+1 = 2.

[Proculation]

DerbyX DerbyX:

We have Harper to prove it. He himself pointed out that both parties would have enacted various taxes, either carbon taxes, GST hikes, or corporate tax increases. In addition he says that under either government we would not have gotten the tax decreases he gave us.

Its simple logic that if both parties had measures to increase taxes then both parties would not be this deep in debt.

Laffer curve. You've read the explanation you know what it is. We are in recession. You don't higher taxes in a recession !

[DerbyX]

Proculation Proculation:

DerbyX DerbyX:

The difference is that neither the Libs or the NDP would be in this deep and had either one of them been in charge then none of the people currently giving Harper the big pass would find this deficit acceptable. This forum would consist on nothing but attack threads decrying the tax and spend leftists philosophy and proclaiming to all that a conservative government would never have done this. Much like they did before, during, and just after the last election.

This is partisanery. Want it or not, the libs would have quite the same and the NDP would have nationalized all industries in difficulty. We are in a recession and they are Keynesians and socialists. 1+1 = 2.

You can't claim they would be as bad yet also believe they would have jacked taxes sky high. Thats not logical Jim.

The fact is you have no proof they would be as bad. Nobody does and its unfair to treat them as if they would have. Unlike Harper, both the Libs and NDP put forth fully costed platforms. Sure the economy tanked but both those parties saw it coming and were attacking Harper for not making preparations before it hit in spades. Both parties were at least thinking recession unlike Harper who said "No recession will happen and no deficit will be in the cards".

[DerbyX]

Proculation Proculation:

DerbyX DerbyX:

We have Harper to prove it. He himself pointed out that both parties would have enacted various taxes, either carbon taxes, GST hikes, or corporate tax increases. In addition he says that under either government we would not have gotten the tax decreases he gave us.

Its simple logic that if both parties had measures to increase taxes then both parties would not be this deep in debt.

Laffer curve. You've read the explanation you know what it is. We are in recession. You don't higher taxes in a recession !

First off the laffer curve is simply a logical curve based on the law of diminishing returns. It doesn't set values because its a theoretical construct and it doesn't say anything about not raising taxes in a recession. It states that the amount of revenue generated vs the tax rate will follow a basic curve. Lots of other variables must be factored in. Its just as reasonable to state that our taxes were lower then the best rate of return and therefore needed to be raised.

Regardless, tax increases during recessions are not verboten nor economically a bad thing especially when you consider that all the leading economists considered Harpers tax cuts as ill-advised at best.

[Thanos]

The fun part in all this is when some partisan hack comes in and says that the numbers for the Liberal/NDP contingency plan are 100% fully accurate, unquestionable, undeniable, and ethically beyond reproach. This all from the very same people who couldn't figure out why their $2 million Gun Registry program became somewhat controversial when the final price tag exceeded $2 billion. Just like all the little brown envelopes changing hands in Quebec were absolutely vital to SAVING CANADA! from separatists, until of course it became critical to overturn the results of an election by making said separatists the contolling arm of an usurper government.

I look at it in the same vein as back in the Cold War when a Soviet official would be asked why Russia wouldn't start any nuclear disarmament until th United States did it first. The answer was usually along the lines the American weaponry was imperialist and offensive while Soviet armament was merely peace-loving and defensive. Orwellian double-talk and the rape of language can, more often than not, be the basis for some absolutely hilarious moments. And never let anyone ever claim that the Liberal party of Canada isn't and ever will be the reigning world masters in the fine political art of pure double-talk. These motherfuckers are so awesome at it that they'd be able to teach the Clintons a few useful lessons on triangulation. Study your Machiavelli and your Orwell because they're all you'll ever have to learn about the Liberals of Canada.

[DerbyX]

Theres a surprise. A con hack mentioning adscam or the gun registry Harper secretly loves.

I just love how you guys are so dead certain the Libs would be as bad as Harper's cons.

[Thanos]

Yep, a 1000% cost over-run on a program designed to intimidate duck hunters just isn't worth talking about anymore. We're the Liberals, our new numbers have been blessed by just about every saint in the comic book, and are totally down-to-the-dime reliable.

[DerbyX]

Thanos Thanos:

Yep, a 1000% cost over-run on a program designed to intimidate duck hunters just isn't worth talking about anymore. We're the Liberals, our new numbers have been blessed by just about every saint in the comic book, and are totally down-to-the-dime reliable.

The conservatives would have done the same thing.

[Gunnair]

DerbyX DerbyX:

Theres a surprise. A con hack mentioning adscam or the gun registry Harper secretly loves.

I just love how you guys are so dead certain the Libs would be as bad as Harper's cons.

I suspect the point is that stating what the Libs/NDP would have done is pure speculation posing as fact since they were never put in the position to do anything.

[DerbyX]

Gunnair Gunnair:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Theres a surprise. A con hack mentioning adscam or the gun registry Harper secretly loves.

I just love how you guys are so dead certain the Libs would be as bad as Harper's cons.

I suspect the point is that stating what the Libs/NDP would have done is pure speculation posing as fact since they were never put in the position to do anything.

Agreed. If they want to say the Libs and/or NDP would do the same then by all means lets put them in power and find out.

[ASLplease]

DerbyX DerbyX:

172 billion over 5 years would be a lot less with our original 7% GST. An increase in personal tax, EI premiums, corporate tax. Anything is better then a massive deficit.

wow. are you saying that when the CPC cut the gstm they gave Canadians over $172 billion in tax breaks? That is "massive" tax breaks.

[Gunnair]

DerbyX DerbyX:

Gunnair Gunnair:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Theres a surprise. A con hack mentioning adscam or the gun registry Harper secretly loves.

I just love how you guys are so dead certain the Libs would be as bad as Harper's cons.

I suspect the point is that stating what the Libs/NDP would have done is pure speculation posing as fact since they were never put in the position to do anything.

Agreed. If they want to say the Libs and/or NDP would do the same then by all means lets put them in power and find out.

Or to say they would not have done the same is also idle speculation and hardly merits as a point of debate. It's a guess and nothing more.