[QBall]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

lily lily:

Come on, Bart. Stay on topic.

Why shouldn't SSMs be allowed?

Repeat after me, Lily: I WANT my children to grow up to be gay or lesbian.

Say it.

Out loud.

Really.

Tell me that having your little boy grow up to be by random men is just as appealing to you as having him grow up to be a husband to a loving wife and a father to your grandchildren? Tell me that having your little girl with some crew-cutted mean faced lesbian appeals to you more than having her married to a nice guy and raising grandkids?

I doubt you'll admit to me on this board that you don't want your kids to grow up gay and you'll probably give me the usual pabulum of how you'll love them no matter what (I'd expect that since I know you to love your kids anyway) but I do expect in the back of your mind that you'll have a pang of regret if your kids all turn out queer.

And that's what's wrong with SSM - it tells society to accept as 'normal' something that is destructive and repugnant to normal and decent people.

Wait! let me get my flak jacket on. Okay, fire away.

[roger-roger]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

lily lily:

Come on, Bart. Stay on topic.

Why shouldn't SSMs be allowed?

Repeat after me, Lily: I WANT my children to grow up to be gay or lesbian.

Say it.

Out loud.

Really.

Tell me that having your little boy grow up to be by random men is just as appealing to you as having him grow up to be a husband to a loving wife and a father to your grandchildren? Tell me that having your little girl with some crew-cutted mean faced lesbian appeals to you more than having her married to a nice guy and raising grandkids?

I doubt you'll admit to me on this board that you don't want your kids to grow up gay and you'll probably give me the usual pabulum of how you'll love them no matter what (I'd expect that since I know you to love your kids anyway) but I do expect in the back of your mind that you'll have a pang of regret if your kids all turn out queer.

And that's what's wrong with SSM - it tells society to accept as 'normal' something that is destructive and repugnant to normal and decent people.

So homosexuality is repugnant and abnormal "to normal and decent people" this is just proves who skewed and biggoted your view on the world really is. To see all people as equal just doesnt fit your world view, get with the 21st century asshat.

What makes you think that every gay person is some sort of whore scewing anyone they can??!! What gay people do you talk to? I know two girls who are married to each other, and they are both in the military. They have a completely devoted relationship to each other, neither are having sex with any girl they can find.

[KyleEverett]

I try to be polite with people who don't agree with me. I dislike conflict, but I go over the edge when people refer to me as something that should be treated as trash.

I look at one of my friends who feels so lost and desperate because California, a state that is about as liberal as you can get, has decided that we are 2nd class. Come on, it wasn't half a century ago when it was interracial marriages that were a sin against god. Granted my own position is that marriage is a function of the church, not the state and that civil unions should be the terms for all 2 person couples, but until that happens, I want equality.

For me its not about being called married, its the right to see my lover in the hospital, to not have to fight with his bigoted relatives over his estate should something happen to him. Its about having spousal benefits from my employer. Its about being able to make a life with the person I fell in love with by biology or choice.

To hear people parade their religion on this issue I beg them please show me the clause in the Constitution that says the US is a Christian state. As far as I know there is still separation of church and state. If it is not so, please please change the Constitution so I know and I can move my ass out of a Theocracy.

Gods, why must history repeat itself, instead of the KKK with have Focus on the Family, instead of lynchings, we have gay panic and gay bashing. If anyone thinks any other human being deserves this type of treatment, then I am glad I have nothing to do with their religion, for no god gives you the right to deny that I am deserving of respect, love, and equality. Any religion that preaches that deserves to be in the same cesspit that most of us place extremist muslims. Hello pot calling the kettle black! I am so damn tired of self-righteous Christians forcing their views on us.

I don't believe that marriage equality is going to destroy the institution. If two men or two women professing their love to each other will destroy your marriage, then you didn't have a healthy marriage to being with. And if you fear for your children's purity, sorry to destroy your fantasy, but kids will learn about homosexuality, drugs, sex, and other stuff if you want them to or not! You cannot protect children from the reality of life. If you are, then how about you claim a state like Oklahoma or Utah, make it a Christian state, and let the rest of us live as we please!

I just want to be seen as an equal to all other human beings. I don't want to feel like crap any more. I don't want to see my friends get beat up for being gay. I want to be able to raise a family with the man I love.

Its enough to make me abandon the country I grew up in and care for. I keep wanting to give America a chance, and I thought with Obama winning and the Democrats increasing their majorities that we'd have a shot. I truly hope that if Christianity is right, that when the religious right dies, they meet their god and he tells them they got it wrong by being hateful bastards who treat other human beings as dirt.

[roger-roger]

[Mustang1]

KyleEverett KyleEverett:

I try to be polite with people who don't agree with me. I dislike conflict, but I go over the edge when people refer to me as something that should be treated as trash.

I look at one of my friends who feels so lost and desperate because California, a state that is about as liberal as you can get, has decided that we are 2nd class. Come on, it wasn't half a century ago when it was interracial marriages that were a sin against god. Granted my own position is that marriage is a function of the church, not the state and that civil unions should be the terms for all 2 person couples, but until that happens, I want equality.

For me its not about being called married, its the right to see my lover in the hospital, to not have to fight with his bigoted relatives over his estate should something happen to him. Its about having spousal benefits from my employer. Its about being able to make a life with the person I fell in love with by biology or choice.

To hear people parade their religion on this issue I beg them please show me the clause in the Constitution that says the US is a Christian state. As far as I know there is still separation of church and state. If it is not so, please please change the Constitution so I know and I can move my ass out of a Theocracy.

Gods, why must history repeat itself, instead of the KKK with have Focus on the Family, instead of lynchings, we have gay panic and gay bashing. If anyone thinks any other human being deserves this type of treatment, then I am glad I have nothing to do with their religion, for no god gives you the right to deny that I am deserving of respect, love, and equality. Any religion that preaches that deserves to be in the same cesspit that most of us place extremist muslims. Hello pot calling the kettle black! I am so damn tired of self-righteous Christians forcing their views on us.

I don't believe that marriage equality is going to destroy the institution. If two men or two women professing their love to each other will destroy your marriage, then you didn't have a healthy marriage to being with. And if you fear for your children's purity, sorry to destroy your fantasy, but kids will learn about homosexuality, drugs, sex, and other stuff if you want them to or not! You cannot protect children from the reality of life. If you are, then how about you claim a state like Oklahoma or Utah, make it a Christian state, and let the rest of us live as we please!

I just want to be seen as an equal to all other human beings. I don't want to feel like crap any more. I don't want to see my friends get beat up for being gay. I want to be able to raise a family with the man I love.

Its enough to make me abandon the country I grew up in and care for. I keep wanting to give America a chance, and I thought with Obama winning and the Democrats increasing their majorities that we'd have a shot. I truly hope that if Christianity is right, that when the religious right dies, they meet their god and he tells them they got it wrong by being hateful bastards who treat other human beings as dirt.

[hurley_108]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

lily lily:

Come on, Bart. Stay on topic.

Why shouldn't SSMs be allowed?

Repeat after me, Lily: I WANT my children to grow up to be gay or lesbian.

Say it.

Out loud.

Really.

Tell me that having your little boy grow up to be by random men is just as appealing to you as having him grow up to be a husband to a loving wife and a father to your grandchildren? Tell me that having your little girl with some crew-cutted mean faced lesbian appeals to you more than having her married to a nice guy and raising grandkids?

I doubt you'll admit to me on this board that you don't want your kids to grow up gay and you'll probably give me the usual pabulum of how you'll love them no matter what (I'd expect that since I know you to love your kids anyway) but I do expect in the back of your mind that you'll have a pang of regret if your kids all turn out queer.

And that's what's wrong with SSM - it tells society to accept as 'normal' something that is destructive and repugnant to normal and decent people.

And Bart just lost the thread.

[roger-roger]

How often does Bart win anyway?

[TattoodGirl]

Eisensapper Eisensapper:

How often does Bart win anyway?

He doesnt

[TattoodGirl]

Eisensapper Eisensapper:

[simjanes2k]

My apologies for bailing on the thread in the midst of my FAVORITE topic coming up: religion! But alas, I was called away to work for a few hours. In fact I am still at work, but Canadians are addictive and refreshing debate opponents.

Unfortunately there seems to be as little reasoning here as with any typical American with regards to logical reconciliation of political matters. There's a lot of "thats like cuz mom said so" and "lawl u lose teh threds" here that is very strange, relative to the intelligent debate on other parts of the site.

At any rate, the fact that laws have been written according to religious morality since the dawn of time really cannot be disputed. Even our latest far-left laws are based on a form of morality, even if it is not from a large monotheistic organization.

The points here have literally been thus:

Hippy: We should let gays marry!
Neo-con: No way, Christianity does not approve!
Hippy: Don't let morals get into our laws!

Neo-con: We can't let gays marry!
Hippy: But that's judgemental and wrong!
Neo-con: Isn't that morality in laws?
Hippy: (crickets)


The simple fact of our argument here on Canadaka.net is that if you do not respect any form of religion as a guiding force of a large number of people, and that those people want their laws to reflect it, you will never have a meaningful conversation with a conservative. Trust me, I'm not just a right-winger in a sea of left here, I'm an agnostic in an EXTREMELY religious area of the United States as well, even though I share their views on a great deal of policy.

If you dismiss a religion outright, you WILL be ignored and attacked by Christians. Let's try to have a discussion instead, eh?

[roger-roger]

To say religion dictates law in this day and age is just flat out wrong. Moral right and wrong is determined by, what Richard Dawkins refers to as a "Moral Zeitgiest". This is a theory that states the collective view on a subject is every changing with the time, like an invisible specter, views that were held true 5, 10, 50 years ago have evolved into something else. I am fine with Theists ignoring sense and logic, its just when it seriously effects other peoples lives I have an issue with it.

[TattoodGirl]

$1:

The simple fact of our argument here on Canadaka.net is that if you do not respect any form of religion as a guiding force of a large number of people, and that those people want their laws to reflect it, you will never have a meaningful conversation with a conservative.

Quite an assumption there dont you think?...not all conservatives are religious, they are from all varied belief systems. If you looked around this forum or even this thread you would find conservatives not following any religion.

[roger-roger]

simjanes2k your whole religious right to govern law can shut down with the question:
"would you pull an ass out of a pit on the Sabbath?"

[Brenda]

Or Christians supporting SSM

[roger-roger]

TattoodGirl TattoodGirl:

$1:

The simple fact of our argument here on Canadaka.net is that if you do not respect any form of religion as a guiding force of a large number of people, and that those people want their laws to reflect it, you will never have a meaningful conversation with a conservative.

Quite an assumption there dont you think?...not all conservatives are religious, they are from all varied belief systems. If you looked around this forum or even this thread you would find conservatives not following any religion.

TattoodGirl is right, there are very few social conservatives on this site, and most of them cannot form any decent argument to defend thier views. Other then the fact they just dont like it.