[BeaverFever]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

And if my country is so miserable then why did over 100,000 people illegally cross our southern border last month? I don't see them continuing on to Canada, do you?

Because you’ve made your country such a shithole it seems familiar to them, probably.

But let’s be clear in the past 50 years, nobody’s done more to increase the misery and shorten the lifespan of black and brown people than Republicans have in Dozens of different ways, so you can stop pretending to be civil rights crusader on this one issue.

[Strutz]

$1:

Abortion could be banned once heartbeat is detected in some U.S. states

If a new Mississippi law survives a court challenge, it will be nearly impossible for most pregnant women to get an abortion there.

Or, potentially, in neighbouring Louisiana. Or Alabama. Or Georgia.

The Louisiana legislature is halfway toward passing a law -- like the ones enacted in Mississippi and Georgia -- that will ban abortions after a fetal heartbeat is detected, about six weeks into a pregnancy and before many women know they're pregnant. Alabama is on the cusp of approving an even more restrictive bill.

State governments are on a course to virtually eliminate abortion access in large chunks of the Deep South and Midwest. Ohio and Kentucky also have passed heartbeat laws; Missouri's Republican-controlled legislature is considering one.

Their hope is that a more conservative U.S. Supreme Court will approve, spelling the end of the constitutional right to abortion.

More here: https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/abortion-c ... -1.4418526

[Strutz]

llama66 llama66:

While I personally don't like the idea of abortions, like so many other things, I believe government needs to remove itself from our daily lives. If a woman wants an abortion, I think options like adoption (like in my case, mom was only 13) should be offered; but if she still wants an abortion, it's her body and it's her choice. Government should not have a say in what someone does with their body.

I get that an unborn baby is *technically* a life, it's not for the government to decide whether women can or cannot have abortions.

Agreed.

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

[PluggyRug]

Strutz Strutz:

llama66 llama66:

While I personally don't like the idea of abortions, like so many other things, I believe government needs to remove itself from our daily lives. If a woman wants an abortion, I think options like adoption (like in my case, mom was only 13) should be offered; but if she still wants an abortion, it's her body and it's her choice. Government should not have a say in what someone does with their body.

I get that an unborn baby is *technically* a life, it's not for the government to decide whether women can or cannot have abortions.

Agreed.

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

I would add, no religion should have any say in a woman's choice.

[N_Fiddledog]

Strutz Strutz:

llama66 llama66:

While I personally don't like the idea of abortions, like so many other things, I believe government needs to remove itself from our daily lives. If a woman wants an abortion, I think options like adoption (like in my case, mom was only 13) should be offered; but if she still wants an abortion, it's her body and it's her choice. Government should not have a say in what someone does with their body.

I get that an unborn baby is *technically* a life, it's not for the government to decide whether women can or cannot have abortions.

Agreed.

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

Strutz, were you watching BCTV news on Friday?

Did you see the one about the convention in town for children who were born at 25 weeks or so?

Sweet kids. I think you'll agree if you saw it.

Well under Canadian law we Canadians could have had those kids killed if abortionists could have got to them before they exited the birth canal. And, of course, if the mothers had wanted to.

Why would that not be murder?

I heard what you said about how you get it and all, Llama but at 25 weeks it is a baby. It's not just "technically a life." So is murder a choice? Baby's body, mother's choice? Why is it not "My body. My choice," for the little kids at the convention in Vancouver who were born at an age they could have been killed for existing?

See because once one gets that it's just a matter of saying 'OK that feels wrong, but we're talking about heartbeat abortion."

I've been there but then I have to say to myself "Very well if heartbeat abortion is woman's choice but by 25 weeks it's a baby and killing it is murder where's the line then? Somewhere between heartbeat and late term? Where then?"

[N_Fiddledog]

Strutz Strutz:

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

The bill includes an exception for rape, incest, and situations when the mother's health is at risk.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/heartbeat- ... 5-07-live/

[Thanos]

PluggyRug PluggyRug:

I would add, no religion should have any say in a woman's choice.

What the heck is a normal guy like you doing hanging out with those other types?

[N_Fiddledog]

I'm don't think the idea that pro-choice represents the "normal" side is accurate.

[BeaverFever]

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

Strutz Strutz:

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

The bill includes an exception for rape, incest, and situations when the mother's health is at risk.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/heartbeat- ... 5-07-live/

Surprising, considering those are conservatives’ primary means of procreation.

[raydan]

Something I don't understand... some people are against abortion because they consider it to be murder but are OK with the exception for rape or incest.

Why are the exceptions not murder?

[Strutz]

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

Strutz Strutz:

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

The bill includes an exception for rape, incest, and situations when the mother's health is at risk.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/heartbeat- ... 5-07-live/

Good to know that there are situations where it would be acceptable.

[Thanos]

Wonder if they've accounted for miscarriages on the exception-to-prosecution list, or if they're continuing with that part of the plan where the poor girl who suffers one gets treated & interrogated by the police as badly as if she'd been caught with a suitcase full of meth or trying to join ISIS. This is what they're trying to write into some of these laws in the US, that miscarriages are fakes and should be treated like a felony-level crime. Yes, a lot of love in the hearts & minds of the "pro" life types to go along with the rational way they decide things.

[Strutz]

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

Strutz Strutz:

llama66 llama66:

While I personally don't like the idea of abortions, like so many other things, I believe government needs to remove itself from our daily lives. If a woman wants an abortion, I think options like adoption (like in my case, mom was only 13) should be offered; but if she still wants an abortion, it's her body and it's her choice. Government should not have a say in what someone does with their body.

I get that an unborn baby is *technically* a life, it's not for the government to decide whether women can or cannot have abortions.

Agreed.

I have not seen anything that would indicate any exceptions to the changing of the law. Such as:

What if the pregnancy is the result of incest or rape? FFS, how can anyone expect a woman to even remotely want the result of that?

What if the pregnancy will endanger the woman's life, and thus, the child's life, such as in the case of an ectopic pregnancy?

Strutz, were you watching BCTV news on Friday?

Did you see the one about the convention in town for children who were born at 25 weeks or so?

Sweet kids. I think you'll agree if you saw it.

Well under Canadian law we Canadians could have had those kids killed if abortionists could have got to them before they exited the birth canal. And, of course, if the mothers had wanted to.

Why would that not be murder?

I heard what you said about how you get it and all, Llama but at 25 weeks it is a baby. It's not just "technically a life." So is murder a choice? Baby's body, mother's choice? Why is it not "My body. My choice," for the little kids at the convention in Vancouver who were born at an age they could have been killed for existing?

See because once one gets that it's just a matter of saying 'OK that feels wrong, but we're talking about heartbeat abortion."

I've been there but then I have to say to myself "Very well if heartbeat abortion is woman's choice but by 25 weeks it's a baby and killing it is murder where's the line then? Somewhere between heartbeat and late term? Where then?"

No, I did not see that show. I'm sure they were sweet. 25 weeks is nearly 6 months. So, they were pre-mature births.

Where in my post did I say anything about abortions at 25 weeks?

[herbie]

raydan raydan:

Something I don't understand... some people are against abortion because they consider it to be murder but are OK with the exception for rape or incest.

Why are the exceptions not murder?

Same reason every fuckin one is pro death penalty. They're not pro-life at all, they're pro "do wtf I tell ya or we'll punish you bitch". Pro-life's a term conjured up for the Goober States like Right to work laws where there's a large demographic of Gomers and Cletus and Gummie Sues.

[Freakinoldguy]

raydan raydan:

Something I don't understand... some people are against abortion because they consider it to be murder but are OK with the exception for rape or incest.

Why are the exceptions not murder?

Me neither but then again, alot of the pro abortionist I've talked to don't seem to have any issue with the Gov't interfering in a parents right to dictate how a sick child is treated or not treated?

This whole argument would appear to boil down to "when does a life become a life" and we have two different opinions on that subject it. So until they define it unequivocally it still remains the woman's choice because she'll be the one who has to live with that choice just like the parents of sick children will who chose prayer over medical procedures.

It's a pretty fucked up world when you think about it.