[Regina]

andyt andyt:

Not sure what you're asking here. What's your definition of alcoholism?

I asked you first.

[andyt]

And I answered you, so your turn.

[ShepherdsDog]

Brenda Brenda:

Most responsible women who are trying, reduce their alcohol consumption. Women who are using contraception usually are not, and don't have to.

I was extremely cautious with my contraception, yet I got pregnant anyway. During my pregnancy, I drank 1 whole glass of wine (on New Years Eve, I was 6.5 months pregnant). I have never been SO sick in my life. I felt like I was giving premature birth to my baby through my mouth (yeah, I know, technically impossible, but it sure as hell felt like that ).

The way of the body to get rid of toxins in amazing. NEVER underestimate the healing power of the body.

The second trimester is supposed to be the most dangerous time to consume alcohol for the fetus.

[jason700]

Not sure if I'm understanding the article. He's getting 18 months house arrest which is not at home but in a rehab facility?

[andyt]

He has to stay at the rehab place for 18 months. Whether he's under house arrest there I don't know - they may allow him absences if he's clean. I missed that part - it's better than just letting him walk. It's the right place for him. I think his probation period should have been longer than 2 years tho.

[Regina]

andyt andyt:

And I answered you, so your turn.

No. My question was who decides when there is a "negative" impact on the user?

Personally I think?
Typically its someone who is depended on alcohol, repetitive use in excess, someone who has developed withdrawal when stopping or reducing consumption and those who have cirrhosis of the liver. Can also be someone that can't function normally in society, like those who really don't drink that much but feel they have no control of themselves when they do. Excess and normal may be subjective but that's about it.

[raydan]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

The second trimester is supposed to be the most dangerous time to consume alcohol for the fetus.

We're always looking for an "out", that's human nature.

But even though I've never been pregnant (never will), I don't think you should consume alcohol at any time during the pregnancy. Just like you shouldn't smoke nor take any drugs. I know, some drugs are considered "safe", but I wouldn't take the risk. The rule should be, don't give your fetus anything you wouldn't give your 1 year old.

[andyt]

Regina Regina:

andyt andyt:

And I answered you, so your turn.

No. My question was who decides when there is a "negative" impact on the user?

Personally I think?
Typically its someone who is depended on alcohol, repetitive use in excess, someone who has developed withdrawal when stopping or reducing consumption and those who have cirrhosis of the liver. Can also be someone that can't function normally in society, like those who really don't drink that much but feel they have no control of themselves when they do. Excess and normal may be subjective but that's about it.

What's excess? Is someone who binges once a month, or once a weekend as I did when I was young an alcoholic?

As for who decides what's negative for the user, seems to me it's a combination. The user can be in denial, so if other people see problems in behavior or physical health that s/he can't or won't, IMO they're still an alcoholic. OTOH, if the user comes to therapy saying they want to quit/reduce but can't, even if there aren't any other problems, well then it's having a negative impact on them and they're an alcoholic.

I guess by my definition I was an alcoholic in my twenties. I did stupid things like drive drunk, came close to getting in fights, and sometimes spent more money on booze than I was comfortable with. I couldn't "quit" because I wanted the life that came with that sort of drinking. OTOH I didn't drink every day, could only do binge once a week, where some of the guys I know could just pound it away all week long. And, once I grew up a bit more I just tapered off to where I only drank one or two for the taste, not to get drunk. And now I've stopped that too, because I don't like the taste anymore. But damn, I miss a cold beer on a hot day.

[andyt]

raydan raydan:

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

The second trimester is supposed to be the most dangerous time to consume alcohol for the fetus.

We're always looking for an "out", that's human nature.

But even though I've never been pregnant (never will), I don't think you should consume alcohol at any time during the pregnancy. Just like you shouldn't smoke nor take any drugs. I know, some drugs are considered "safe", but I wouldn't take the risk. The rule should be, don't give your fetus anything you wouldn't give your 1 year old.

Alcohol is so much part of our culture, as you say, some people always look for an out to drink. And of course the drinkers try to pressure people who are trying to abstain - 'come on, one won't hurt you.'

[jason700]

andyt andyt:

He has to stay at the rehab place for 18 months. Whether he's under house arrest there I don't know - they may allow him absences if he's clean. I missed that part - it's better than just letting him walk. It's the right place for him. I think his probation period should have been longer than 2 years tho.

The article DOES allude to it being house arrest but is definitely not clear about it. I don't see how 6 to 12 months in prison is a better option. Anyone care to enlighten me?

[andyt]

I agree. If he's locked up in rehab for 18 months that's better than prison for 12. I don't think he's locked up tho. He can leave, then they report to his parole officer, who decides whether to revoke, then it goes to court where they find that Gladue rules and he can't be locked up just for violating his parole.

[Freakinoldguy]

Here's another story on the case that came out today. I don't know if it sheds more light on the issue, but I found it interesting to see that Louie was willing to use a weapon to prevent himself from being apprehended which shows how much remorse he really felt after he punched the driver.

http://www2.canada.com/nanaimodailynews ... 5f7bd76505

$1:

On Feb. 15, 2011, Louie, along with two friends, boarded a bus through the back door. When Dixon told him to get off the bus and line up at the front door, like the other passengers, Louie punched Dixon on the right cheek, breaking his bone.

He also swung a four-foot stick at Dixon's son, Aaron, when he tried to follow Louie to apprehend him.

Dixon required surgery that placed a plate and screws on his face. He was also left with other injuries, including a concussion, nerve damage, cognitive problems and psychological scars.

Louie had pleaded guilty and apologized for his actions.

[jason700]

This article is more vague about the sentencing than the original source. Sensationalism... make it seem like he got nothing, create drama, sell papers.

[Benn]

jason700 jason700:

andyt andyt:

He has to stay at the rehab place for 18 months. Whether he's under house arrest there I don't know - they may allow him absences if he's clean. I missed that part - it's better than just letting him walk. It's the right place for him. I think his probation period should have been longer than 2 years tho.

The article DOES allude to it being house arrest but is definitely not clear about it. I don't see how 6 to 12 months in prison is a better option. Anyone care to enlighten me?

Because as has been mentioned (If as its claimed, his FAS made him do it), you can't cure FAS. SO we can have him sitting in one place (rehab) where he won't get better but at any time can leave at any time he wants and punch someone else out, or worse, or have him somewhere that the public will be safe from his actions for at least a certain period of time, and he still won't get cured.

[ShepherdsDog]

keeping him 'incarcerated' protects unsuspecting innocents from his uncontrollable violent outbursts