[EyeBrock]

I don't know what the answer is Curt, but this stuff makes the average Brit's blood boil and these guys know that.

I think things have already gone too far in the UK for a peaceful outcome with these mainly Pakistani groups.

[Gunnair]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

I don't know what the answer is Curt, but this stuff makes the average Brit's blood boil and these guys know that.

I think things have already gone too far in the UK for a peaceful outcome with these mainly Pakistani groups.

Doesn't seem to be boiling enough yet...

[martin14]

Gunnair Gunnair:

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

I don't know what the answer is Curt, but this stuff makes the average Brit's blood boil and these guys know that.

I think things have already gone too far in the UK for a peaceful outcome with these mainly Pakistani groups.

Doesn't seem to be boiling enough yet...

Agreed, I really wonder what it's going to take to wake them up.

[andyt]

Curtman Curtman:

desertdude desertdude:

As for the OP I think UK needs to get a pair of balls and arrest these people. Lebanon just sentenced their guru to life the least they can do is lock them up for a few weeks/months/years to knock some sense into them. If nothing just to send the message across that this wont be tolerated no more.

Tolerance is something that many of us take pride in. I don't think people should be locked up for expressing their opinion, no matter how disrespectful it is. They've earned shame and indignation. That's a fair punishment.

You start arresting people for speech and there goes your democracy. If they advocate violence that's another matter. What I would like to see is Britons that abhor this protest to find out the identity of these people and start protesting them. Make their lives uncomfortable.

[EyeBrock]

Gunnair Gunnair:

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

I don't know what the answer is Curt, but this stuff makes the average Brit's blood boil and these guys know that.

I think things have already gone too far in the UK for a peaceful outcome with these mainly Pakistani groups.

Doesn't seem to be boiling enough yet...

If you believe what you read in the media, no. I'm going off talking to friends and family in the North West of England and the frank and varied input they have given me.

This kind of stuff isn't a one-off in Bradford, Oldham, Salford, Manchester etc. Resentment is bubbling very close to the surface.

An issue is that the opposite side of the coin is currently in the hands of the English Defence League, the BNP and others with a more extreme agenda. These groups are proponents of barely disguised a Nazi ideology.

Whatever some of you guys think about my views and those of many other Brits on tolerance and diversity, fascism was something our grandparents generation fought against, many of them died for their convictions. The latest generation of Mosely’s black-shirts hold no more attraction as a viable political voice than they did in the 1930’s.

If these Pakistani groups keep the hate and agitation up though, more people will see the extremist routes that the EDL and BNP espouse as a pragmatic if distasteful way of dealing with this issue.

The politically correct brigade, by refusing to address these problems in open debate have created a larger one. Failing to discuss means the only voices heard are those of the extremists.

Enoch Powell’s apocalyptic predictions may yet come true.

[andyt]

Brock - are the BNP and EDL fascist tho? In the sense they want a fascist type of government? Or are they merely white supremacists, ie England for traditional, white Britons? The first of course would completely invalidate them.

But I bet it's more the second. And I would say that both you and I, to some degree are white supremacists. I doubt if you see yourself that way, and I know I don't. I don't think white people are superior. But I think we both agree that European based culture is superior, or at least one we want to retain. If you agree with that, then we are both saying that the west should endeavor to remain "white" for the foreseeable future, with immigration limited to a point where the immigrants don't have a huge impact on the culture, but instead are forced to assimilate with the culture already present in the country they move to. Of course it's probably already too late for that for Britan, and it certainly is for Canada.

What did Enoch Powell predict?

(Just to be clear, since on this forum you can never tell, I'm not advocating white supremacy. I am advocating European based cultural supremacy for countries with a primarily European origin population. White supremacy is idiotic. But it's easy to see how people feeling threatened would react in that way.)

[EyeBrock]

I don't think white people are superior and I've been at the sharp-end of Anglo superiority being half-Irish with full-on Irish parents from Cork and Dublin. Being Irish in 1970’s England wasn’t fun.

I've also travelled to over 60 countries and my view of my country of birth reflects my travels. I left.

I do think that there are many good things in English and British culture which are being ignored because of a misguided attempt to promote 'diversity'. Mix this in with a white underclass that has grown exponentially in the past 20 years or so and you have a nation riddled with self-doubt and self-loathing. No white superiority on the shitty housing estates where I was dragged up.

I have seen the BNP at first hand. They are nothing more than Nazi's with accents. The EDL pretend to be more moderate but they are the same shit and just taking advantage of the vacuum left by the supposed mainstream plonkers who are happy to let this stuff go on.

I am a big fan of Indians and I believe their culture is a good match for the UK. Don't forget what is 'British' culture is an amalgam of dozens of very distinct cultures that invaders brought with them. They did change the Brits but in the end were absorbed.

The UK is a very individual kind of place compared to most of Europe. Nobody really managed to subjugate us in the same way that the Euro's were. We had the English Channel and North Sea to defend us, and really, our weather makes a full-on invasion less shiny than say invading the south of France.

Enoch Powell and his ‘Rivers of Blood’? Have a search and you’ll see his particular brand of politics which aired in the 1960’s, hot on the heels of the collapse of the Empire.

[Yogi]

...until all British soldiers are withdrawn from Muslim countries.


In return, they, would be willing to remove ALL muslims from non-muslim countries!!!

That's a trade-off I could go for!

[PublicAnimalNo9]

Curtman Curtman:

Tolerance is something that many of us take pride in. I don't think people should be locked up for expressing their opinion, no matter how disrespectful it is. They've earned shame and indignation. That's a fair punishment.

There's a distinct difference between tolerance and being a door mat

[ShepherdsDog]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

If you believe what you read in the media, no. I'm going off talking to friends and family in the North West of England and the frank and varied input they have given me.

This kind of stuff isn't a one-off in Bradford, Oldham, Salford, Manchester etc. Resentment is bubbling very close to the surface.

An issue is that the opposite side of the coin is currently in the hands of the English Defence League, the BNP and others with a more extreme agenda. These groups are proponents of barely disguised a Nazi ideology.

Whatever some of you guys think about my views and those of many other Brits on tolerance and diversity, fascism was something our grandparents generation fought against, many of them died for their convictions. The latest generation of Mosely’s black-shirts hold no more attraction as a viable political voice than they did in the 1930’s.

If these Pakistani groups keep the hate and agitation up though, more people will see the extremist routes that the EDL and BNP espouse as a pragmatic if distasteful way of dealing with this issue.

The politically correct brigade, by refusing to address these problems in open debate have created a larger one. Failing to discuss means the only voices heard are those of the extremists.

Enoch Powell’s apocalyptic predictions may yet come true.

By today's standards, the views of the EDL and the BNP appear 'extreme'. To label them as fascist and naziesque would be to label our grandparents as Nazis and fascists, as these views are better seen as old fashioned. Hell, even the liberals of the 30s, 40s and 50s would be viewed as extreme right wingers using our current political spectrum.

[EyeBrock]

Yea but we've moved on Shep. The BNP and EDL haven't. We don't go queer bashing anymore either.......

[Johnny_H]

I had a pretty comedic experience with the BNP. I had a bunch of youtube videos up, mostly montages and tributes to various wars, regiments, etc. Anyways being a native Canadian I didn't know what a "British National Party" was and every time I expressed my respect for the Monarchy these guys would flock to my youtube channel.

To make a long story short, I ended up getting a message and video in my inbox saying that foreigners are leeches on society and for me to sign some petition to that effect. I ended up going through my youtube account disabling all comments and taking out the garbage from my "friends list".

I thought it was kind of funny, that's how I learned who the BNP were.

[ShepherdsDog]

Are they lynching or attacking gays, or are they merely expressing a dislike of the homosexual lifestyle? Once they begin advocating violence based on sexual preference, that is 'gay-bashing' and is criminal. If it's the former, then the Catholic Church participates in it too. As for moving on, we did yes, but fascism hasn't and can't. We can't suddenly label certain things fascist, that weren't seen as such before, because others views have changed. The evil of fascism is a constant. Outmoded, old fashioned and behind the times are all better terms, fascist and nazi aren't. it's no different than the the black bloc calling the police fascists or nazis. In their skewed views, any semblance of law and order is wrong.

If things continue to get worse in Britain, the BNP and the EDL will grow in popularity, as the liberals and moderates are viewed as having pulled a Chamberlain. They had the chance to fix things, they dropped the ball, so now it's time for a Churchill to fix their mess. It is a cultural war, and we need to make sure it doesn't turn hot.

[EyeBrock]

The BNP are just the National Front in cheap suits with a Lord or two.

Mosley would be proud.

[Gunnair]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

Gunnair Gunnair:

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

I don't know what the answer is Curt, but this stuff makes the average Brit's blood boil and these guys know that.

I think things have already gone too far in the UK for a peaceful outcome with these mainly Pakistani groups.

Doesn't seem to be boiling enough yet...

If you believe what you read in the media, no. I'm going off talking to friends and family in the North West of England and the frank and varied input they have given me.

This kind of stuff isn't a one-off in Bradford, Oldham, Salford, Manchester etc. Resentment is bubbling very close to the surface.

An issue is that the opposite side of the coin is currently in the hands of the English Defence League, the BNP and others with a more extreme agenda. These groups are proponents of barely disguised a Nazi ideology.

Whatever some of you guys think about my views and those of many other Brits on tolerance and diversity, fascism was something our grandparents generation fought against, many of them died for their convictions. The latest generation of Mosely’s black-shirts hold no more attraction as a viable political voice than they did in the 1930’s.

If these Pakistani groups keep the hate and agitation up though, more people will see the extremist routes that the EDL and BNP espouse as a pragmatic if distasteful way of dealing with this issue.

The politically correct brigade, by refusing to address these problems in open debate have created a larger one. Failing to discuss means the only voices heard are those of the extremists.

Enoch Powell’s apocalyptic predictions may yet come true.

Nothing to do with what I read - everything to do with what I see.

I hope to see more.