[uwish]

DerbyX DerbyX:

No, the Liberals wanted measures to avoid a massive deficit. The CPC does not. Massive deficits never bothered the conservatives before so why should they now?

no they didn't so you mean to tell me that Dion's 30 billion stimulus package wasn't going to be a massive deficit? Where do you think the money was going to come from?

the CPC budget will include sunset clauses to ensure no long term structural debt.

[DerbyX]

uwish uwish:

DerbyX DerbyX:

No, the Liberals wanted measures to avoid a massive deficit. The CPC does not. Massive deficits never bothered the conservatives before so why should they now?

no they didn't so you mean to tell me that Dion's 30 billion stimulus package wasn't going to be a massive deficit? Where do you think the money was going to come from?

the CPC budget will include sunset clauses to ensure no long term structural debt.

No it wasn't because you forget he included taxes to compensate. Part of the Stimulus package were billion dollar measures to help the environment and that was going to be paid for out of the carbon tax. The NDP wanted corp tax cuts rolled back and the Lib favoured GST rollbacks and/or not cutting income tax any further.

The fact is that Harper cut taxes and raised spending in a reckless manner but you simply won't hold anybody but him responsible for. If his budget is entire one that the Libs/NDP wanted anyway then he might as well step down and let them govern since hes going to blame them for his mistakes.

[uwish]

oooo so the liberal platform was to raise taxes to pay for the 30 billion deficit? maybe that was another reason Canadians didn't want it.

and name one tax that was 'revenue neutral' that stayed revenue neutral....

[Canadian_Mind]

cuttign taxes in a resseccion is dumb, but increasing the spending isn't.

Also, the NDP and Liberal tax increases, particularly the carbon tax, would only further hamper the economy regardless of expendatures, so that would have been a waste of even more money than the conservatives budget in the long term.

[DerbyX]

uwish uwish:

oooo so the liberal platform was to raise taxes to pay for the 30 billion deficit? maybe that was another reason Canadians didn't want it.

and name one tax that was 'revenue neutral' that stayed revenue neutral....

No, the Liberal platform was to use the carbon tax to pay for environment initiatives and to not further cut income taxes or else cut income taxes but raise the GST.

The NDP favoured all spending increases to be made at the expense of corporate tax cuts. They would have provided the stimulus without a deficit. The only question remains what damage the corporate tax cut rollbacks would have.

You want Harper to receive credit for the tax cuts and spending increases but want his massive deficit to be blamed on the Liberals. You are vilifing the Liberal and NDP budgets because you think they were going to run massive deficits yet you willingly accept Harper doing so.

[uwish]

you didn't answer my question Derby. You said the liberals wouldn't go into massive deficits yet you claim their would be no tax increases. SO where does the money come from?

and yes I do blame some of this deficit on the liberals. They are the ones who DEMANDED a stimulus package that the CPC was against but is now in the budget.

you can't have it both ways, you can't say it's all harpers fault when the liberals are the one that WANTED a stimulus package in the 30 billion range, then blame him when brings forth the budget that apparently has many of the spending initiatives the liberals wanted.

make up your mind.

[DerbyX]

uwish uwish:

you didn't answer my question Derby. You said the liberals wouldn't go into massive deficits yet you claim their would be no tax increases. SO where does the money come from?

No I didn't. I claimed that at least part of the stimulus package was going to be green initiatives paid for out of a carbon tax. I also said that the Liberals were not going to further reduce income tax unless it was followed by a raise in the GST. I also never said the Liberals demanded a 30 billion dollar stimulus package because all you are doing is simply taking the entire deficit and attributing that figure to the amount you claim the Libs/NDP demanded.

That is wrong. Everybody demanded action. The Liberals, the NDP, the Greens, and the voters. Each party had its own idea and unlike Harper they released costed platforms. Now you know why Harper did not release one, because he would have had to reveal that his cost plan was billions in the red already.

uwish uwish:

and yes I do blame some of this deficit on the liberals. They are the ones who DEMANDED a stimulus package that the CPC was against but is now in the budget.

They also demanded he not run a massive deficit. They each presented ways to avoid this which when explained to you, you disingenuinely turn around and say "oooh, raise taxes. Thats why the voters rejected it".

You can't claim the voters rejected the Liberal platform for a stimulus package and tax increase then turn around and blame the Liberals for the very deficit their tax plan was designed to avoid.

Can the Liberals blame the conservatives for having less money to put towards social programs because they wanted a large increase in defence spending which Martin provided? Can we blame the opposition parties because in 04/05 we were forced to only pay off a small amount of the debt and use the surplus to spend spend spend because thats what they were promising and we were fighting an election. No. The Liberals took full and sole responsibility, even when running a minority for their budget decisions. The Liberals were held solely accountable for all their budget choices as should Harper.

uwish uwish:

you can't have it both ways, you can't say it's all harpers fault when the liberals are the one that WANTED a stimulus package in the 30 billion range, then blame him when brings forth the budget that apparently has many of the spending initiatives the liberals wanted.

make up your mind.

EVERYBODY wanted that package including you cons. You were the ones demanding we simply hand over money to the auto companies. The Liberals wanted job creation programs, specifically in their green initiatives and the NDP wanted the same though each wanted them paid for differently.

YOU cons wanted HARPER in charge. You cons wanted A massive bailout program and you wanted your tax cuts and therefore you cons are responsible for the massive deficit.

[ziggy]

Derby Derby Derby,my little rodent buddy.
Your making stuff up now.
So who specifically are "you cons"?

$1:

EVERYBODY wanted that package including you cons. You were the ones demanding we simply hand over money to the auto companies.

[ridenrain]

Poor Derby.. Better start calling them child molester soon or we'll stop paying attention.

[DerbyX]

ridenrain ridenrain:

Poor Derby.. Better start calling them child molester soon or we'll stop paying attention.

Like you accusing people of being rapists?

[ziggy]

I dont remember too many "Cons" on this site that were wanting to see a huge auto bailout,help yes,but no bailout without cooperation from the workers.

On yer bike Derby!

[DerbyX]

ziggy ziggy:

Derby Derby Derby,my little rodent buddy.
Your making stuff up now.
So who specifically are "you cons"?

$1:

EVERYBODY wanted that package including you cons. You were the ones demanding we simply hand over money to the auto companies.

It certainly wasn't us Liberals who wanted the govt to hand over fistfuls of money to the auto industry. Seems to me if Harper is the guy doing it then the people who voted for him and will vote for him factor into it.

BTW, my gear box companion, how are these massive deficits not pissing you off and how are they not stealing from the taxpayers since we will be on the hock for all the interest payments hear after?

[DerbyX]

ziggy ziggy:

I dont remember too many "Cons" on this site that were wanting to see a huge auto bailout,help yes,but no bailout without cooperation from the workers.

On yer bike Derby!

I don't recall any Liberals wanting either it nor a massive debt but you don't seem the slightest bit fazed when uwish blames us for what you and your man Harper wanted.

[ziggy]

DerbyX DerbyX:

ziggy ziggy:

Derby Derby Derby,my little rodent buddy.
Your making stuff up now.
So who specifically are "you cons"?

$1:

EVERYBODY wanted that package including you cons. You were the ones demanding we simply hand over money to the auto companies.

It certainly wasn't us Liberals who wanted the govt to hand over fistfuls of money to the auto industry. Seems to me if Harper is the guy doing it then the people who voted for him and will vote for him factor into it.

BTW, my gear box companion, how are these massive deficits not pissing you off and how are they not stealing from the taxpayers since we will be on the hock for all the interest payments hear after?

Your talking to a guy that has to pay EI but cant collect it,at least I know the libs wont be stealing it this time.

[ziggy]

DerbyX DerbyX:

ziggy ziggy:

I dont remember too many "Cons" on this site that were wanting to see a huge auto bailout,help yes,but no bailout without cooperation from the workers.

On yer bike Derby!

I don't recall any Liberals wanting either it nor a massive debt but you don't seem the slightest bit fazed when uwish blames us for what you and your man Harper wanted.

HERE we go again,dude,just because I dont post that this guy or that con is wrong doesnt mean I side with them,you do this constantly.
They have their opinion and I have mine,you seem to think I should be running them down for their opinion.