[DrCaleb]

commanderkai commanderkai:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Thanos Thanos:

Khadr probably can't be prosecuted in Canada. If he comes back without undergoing an American trial of some sort first then he walks free as soon as he gets here. In other words he gets a free pass for an illegal battlefield killing and the values of a openly pro-Al Qaeda family are validated.

Umm, I don't think 7 years at Guantanamo is a 'free pass'. Nor do I think anyone believes that would validate the Kadhr family's hypocritical views on Canada.

Seven years for murder isn't a free pass? Sheesh, I'm going to disagree with you, excessively.

By all means. Many in Remand centres get 2:1 or 3:1 for time there, taken off their sentences because of tough conditions and overcrowding while awaiting sentence.

Manslaughter sometimes results in 5 - 10 year sentences. Assuming there is even proof enough to convict him.

What would be the time off ratio for 7 years of harsh treatment?

[Chumley]

Isn't he still a POW?
And aren't the Americans still in Afganistan?
Do they let captured enemy fighters go before the war has ended?

[2Cdo]

Chumley Chumley:

Isn't he still a POW?
And aren't the Americans still in Afganistan?
Do they let captured enemy fighters go before the war has ended?

And this is exactly where the US failed. If they had only called them POW's and not dicked around with "illegal combatants" and military tribunals and trials, then they could have just held them until the "war on terror" was over. Be that 5 or 50 years.

[Chumley]

2Cdo 2Cdo:

Chumley Chumley:

Isn't he still a POW?
And aren't the Americans still in Afganistan?
Do they let captured enemy fighters go before the war has ended?

And this is exactly where the US failed. If they had only called them POW's and not dicked around with "illegal combatants" and military tribunals and trials, then they could have just held them until the "war on terror" was over. Be that 5 or 50 years.

So illegal combatants should be let go before the war has ended?
Doesn't make sense to let him go before its done whether he is a legal or illegal combatant.

[commanderkai]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

By all means. Many in Remand centres get 2:1 or 3:1 for time there, taken off their sentences because of tough conditions and overcrowding while awaiting sentence.

Manslaughter sometimes results in 5 - 10 year sentences. Assuming there is even proof enough to convict him.

What would be the time off ratio for 7 years of harsh treatment?

Good for the horrible, sad state of the Canadian Judicial System. Murder should be punished to the fullest extent of the law, and he should get nothing less than life in prison. He was an illegal combatant in a nation not of his own. We should of just let the Afghan justice system, to all of its faults, dealt with him.

[Thanos]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

Thanos Thanos:

Khadr probably can't be prosecuted in Canada. If he comes back without undergoing an American trial of some sort first then he walks free as soon as he gets here. In other words he gets a free pass for an illegal battlefield killing and the values of a openly pro-Al Qaeda family are validated.

Keeping him out of Canada, by whatever legal means necessary, is far less dangerous than the example that gets set by allowing him to come "home". The potential debacle that could happen will dwarf the disruption and damage done to legal procedure by the Brenda Martin idiocy. And it gives every Canadian carte blanche to behave in any illegal manner desired when travelling/residing overseas. By what right exactly does Canada (or certain more, ahem, liberal Canadians, to be more precise) presume to ridicule and essentially negate foreign justice systems when Canadians engage in criminality outside our borders?

What gives me the right to riducle the US justice system? Oh, I don't know, freedom of speech, I suppose. I do think it's a little ridiculous to torture and arbitrary detain on a whim and call that a justice system.

Parties over for the torture brigade. Bush adn Cheney are gone. Obamam is in. Yeeee-haw. Score one for the good guys.

I suppose then that you have no problem with the Canadian response to our people getting in trouble overseas now being (using the Brenda Martin case as an example) as follows:

1) Canadian in a foreign country rapes/robs/murders/smuggles/etc. and gets popped by the locals
2) Locals put Canadian through their own system
3) Canadian + family + friends + opportunistic politicians (i.e. Dan McTeague) whine and bitch like crazy to lazy Canadian media about the "terrible injustices being suffered by ONE OF OUR OWN!" (insert trademark here)
4) Canadian gets trial and is found guilty, but gets repatriated home because we don't trust those ignorant little spics to be "fair" about it (which is exactly what we told the Mexicans during the Brenda Martin travesty)
5) Canadian comes home, gets processed out in about two days, celebrations/fireworks/parties everywhere/masturbatory wallowing in self-righteousness as only Canadians can.
6) After a couple of months when all the hype has died out, Canadian says "I'd really like to do some travelling. I think I'll go back to Mexico/Afghanistan/wherever I acted like a criminal earlier".
7) Locals on the other side of the coin scratch their heads in confusion and begin to really wonder what in the royal fuck Canada actually stands for (aside from talking out of both sides of our asses anyway)

Shit a few more rounds of this sort of stuff and we'll be the most popular kids on the block, won't we? Here come some Canadians, close the fuckin' beach already.

(And, BTW, why were liberal types so notoriously silent when Will Sampson was getting tortured for real by the Saudis a few years back during Chretiens reign of error? Wrong gender and wrong skin colour for genuine libbos to get all worked up over?)

[poquas]

putz putz:

Killing a medic is a war crime

Can't pick and choose on what is and isn't international law. If you invoke the "killing a medic" thing, he's going to counter with the "child soldier" thing.

Besides, there's some serious doubt about that particular charge. I suspect he's going to have the charges dropped. My only concern is how to keep him out of Canada.

[hwacker]

poquas poquas:

putz putz:

Killing a medic is a war crime

Can't pick and choose on what is and isn't international law. If you invoke the "killing a medic" thing, he's going to counter with the "child soldier" thing.

Besides, there's some serious doubt about that particular charge. I suspect he's going to have the charges dropped. My only concern is how to keep him out of Canada.

A Canadian in Afghanistan cannot kill a solider of the USA military. Send him back to afghan and stone him to death.

[poquas]

hwacker hwacker:

A Canadian in Afghanistan cannot kill a solider of the USA military.

Says who?

Either we rely on the rule of law or we don't. If you make up the rules as you go, you're no better than Bush and his cronies.

If we follow international law THAT THE US IS SUPPOSED TO BE SIGNATORY TO, they'll have to let him go as a child soldier. Otherwise it's Bush's rules and he'll be killed without anyone knowing where the body is.

As I stated earlier, I don't personally care what happens to him or any of the other "political prisoners" in that hell hole, and I certainly don't want any of them back here. The point is that America created the problem and America has to clean it up.

[DrCaleb]

commanderkai commanderkai:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

By all means. Many in Remand centres get 2:1 or 3:1 for time there, taken off their sentences because of tough conditions and overcrowding while awaiting sentence.

Manslaughter sometimes results in 5 - 10 year sentences. Assuming there is even proof enough to convict him.

What would be the time off ratio for 7 years of harsh treatment?

Good for the horrible, sad state of the Canadian Judicial System. Murder should be punished to the fullest extent of the law, and he should get nothing less than life in prison. He was an illegal combatant in a nation not of his own. We should of just let the Afghan justice system, to all of its faults, dealt with him.

That's the thing, Canada has laws to deal with people who attack troops of our allies. Doesn't matter if he's an 'illegal combatant' 'soldier' 'mercenary' or whatever label you give him. And the punishments are on par with 'murder'.

[ShepherdsDog]

poquas poquas:

. My only concern is how to keep him out of Canada.

Let him know this is the welcome he can expect if he tries to re enter Canada.

[hwacker]

poquas poquas:

hwacker hwacker:

A Canadian in Afghanistan cannot kill a solider of the USA military.

Says who?

Either we rely on the rule of law or we don't. If you make up the rules as you go, you're no better than Bush and his cronies.

If we follow international law THAT THE US IS SUPPOSED TO BE SIGNATORY TO, they'll have to let him go as a child soldier. Otherwise it's Bush's rules and he'll be killed without anyone knowing where the body is.

As I stated earlier, I don't personally care what happens to him or any of the other "political prisoners" in that hell hole, and I certainly don't want any of them back here. The point is that America created the problem and America has to clean it up.

Canada is not fighting the USA or Afghanistan. He was born in Canada and should die in Afghanistan.

Unless you have a signed military contract from this little POS ?

[poquas]

Again you imply there’s a legal statute to address this.

There isn’t. Bush had to break his own laws to create Gitmo and you have to accept that and stop making up your own rules.

Any reference to a law brings it back to the LAW regarding child soldiers. In that case he walks. In all probability he’s going to walk anyway. I’m more concerned with where he goes and what he does.

[DrCaleb]

poquas poquas:

Again you imply there’s a legal statute to address this.

High treason

46. (1) Every one commits high treason who, in Canada,

(a) kills or attempts to kill Her Majesty, or does her any bodily harm tending to death or destruction, maims or wounds her, or imprisons or restrains her;

(b) levies war against Canada or does any act preparatory thereto; or

(c) assists an enemy at war with Canada, or any armed forces against whom Canadian Forces are engaged in hostilities, whether or not a state of war exists between Canada and the country whose forces they are.

Canadian citizen
(3) Notwithstanding subsection (1) or (2), a Canadian citizen or a person who owes allegiance to Her Majesty in right of Canada,

(a) commits high treason if, while in or out of Canada, he does anything mentioned in subsection (1); or

(b) commits treason if, while in or out of Canada, he does anything mentioned in subsection (2).

http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/ShowDoc/cs ... nting=true

[poquas]

AGAIN, it's all trumped by the internationally agreed to child soldier laws.

The only place in the world that can hold him is Gitmo, and that's about to change.