[Thanos]

Something with stable law and order and not a fucked up Hobbesian anarcho libertarian nightmare where "rights " based selfishness is running completely amok?

[DrCaleb]

shockedcanadian shockedcanadian:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

'Property' however consists of more than just 'land'. Your car is property, your cell phone, the clothes an your back . . .does the State own those?

That's a separate issue which has no place in this discussion.

It is actually directly related to this discussion.

shockedcanadian shockedcanadian:

Of course the state doesn't own these assets, but, the state has legal right to access to these in the process of a criminal investigation. So DNA evidencefrom your clothes, phone records if you are a terrorist etc.

No, the state does not have such rights. They give themselves such rights, but we actually have the constitutional right against unlawful search and sezuire, just the government ignores it because they are the 900 pound gorilla. So they unlawfully search our phone records etc. And they have limited ability to seize our DNA.

shockedcanadian shockedcanadian:

This is completely different from property, which is an immovable, static and limited asset. It is also required for community development and progress, whether in development of homes, or telephone lines, sewage etc. It is why it is such a valuable assets to own for investment purposes and a sense of pride and accomplishment to those who want to pursue their desire for liberty.

No, the legal definition of 'property' includes things you posess, other than 'land'. Which is the whole point of the article!

shockedcanadian shockedcanadian:

What kind of country does Canada want to be?

Free. As in 'speech' not as in 'beer'.

[BartSimpson]

Thanos Thanos:

Something with stable law and order and not a fucked up Hobbesian anarcho libertarian nightmare where "rights " based selfishness is running completely amok?

Rights are for a moral people. Laws are for a post-moral people.

[Thanos]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Thanos Thanos:

Something with stable law and order and not a fucked up Hobbesian anarcho libertarian nightmare where "rights " based selfishness is running completely amok?

Rights are for a moral people. Laws are for a post-moral people.

Rights are wasted on immoral people, and elevating their rights above those that aren't depraved destroys a society as much as pouring a concentrated corrosive agent on a piece of metal.

[herbie]

This isn't abut property rights, its about abuse of power. Seizing cars because of what you blew on an uncalibrated Walmart breathalyzer, grabbing your house because you couldn't evict a tenant running a grow-op under Catch22 rental acts, being presumed guilty of a crime if anything you bought is with cash.
It's got so ridiculous I've seen people with a wad of $5 bills being asked by the bank teller to explain where they got so many of them before they'd deposit them.
Listen to all the talk these days, everyone presumes that every sale of a home for cash is a criminal transaction. People are buying into the idea that everything should be traceable by the gov't.

[BartSimpson]

herbie herbie:

This isn't abut property rights, its about abuse of power. Seizing cars because of what you blew on an uncalibrated Walmart breathalyzer, grabbing your house because you couldn't evict a tenant running a grow-op under Catch22 rental acts, being presumed guilty of a crime if anything you bought is with cash.
It's got so ridiculous I've seen people with a wad of $5 bills being asked by the bank teller to explain where they got so many of them before they'd deposit them.
Listen to all the talk these days, everyone presumes that every sale of a home for cash is a criminal transaction. People are buying into the idea that everything should be traceable by the gov't.

If you didn't do anything wrong you've got nothing to hide, right?

[herbie]

Says the man to the people where they delete, delete, delete off gov't servers and the Finance Minister "doesn't use email" in 2016.
And knows the POTUS is just the President of the USA and can't do jack shit about Benghazis but send some drones and a Secratary of State is even less.