[PluggyRug]

andyt andyt:

Blaming the whales or seals for the problems of over fishing is just bullshit.

Exactly!

[jeff744]

andyt andyt:

Hell, I'm such a nice guy I looked it up for you. Seems the whaling nations blame whales for declining fish stocks, while the anti-whalers call bullshit. We've had exactly the same argument with seals. Seals and whales co-existed with fish long before humans got involved, and the fish were plentiful. Portugese fishers, when they first got here would just scoop cod out of the sea with hand nets. We know that predators keep populations healthy, unlike human hunting. Blaming the whales or seals for the problems of over fishing is just bullshit.

So, how many salmon did the seals release into water last year? We have already started major attempts at restocking and large scale is still an imperfect science but we are getting better at it regularly while we are also working to decrease our reliance on the oceans. At the same time we need to control some populations and monitor others so we can actually figure out which fish we need to worry about most and let other ones recover. Some populations of fish die off regularly because their population booms and they eat all the food in their spawning areas making the next spawning period have a sharp drop in the population. Salmon in BC are an example as one of the major issues was that there were too many fish in a small area and they simply could not support the population.

[andyt]

jeff744 jeff744:

So, how many salmon did the seals release into water last year? We have already started major attempts at restocking and large scale is still an imperfect science but we are getting better at it regularly while we are also working to decrease our reliance on the oceans. At the same time we need to control some populations and monitor others so we can actually figure out which fish we need to worry about most and let other ones recover. Some populations of fish die off regularly because their population booms and they eat all the food in their spawning areas making the next spawning period have a sharp drop in the population. Salmon in BC are an example as one of the major issues was that there were too many fish in a small area and they simply could not support the population.

Jeff, where are you getting this bullshit from - The Ecorapists Monthly? Sure populations will grow and decline in response to environmental factors. And if we were smart we would reduce our catch when populations are low, not blame predators who will crash right along with a prey population.

[jeff744]

andyt andyt:

jeff744 jeff744:

So, how many salmon did the seals release into water last year? We have already started major attempts at restocking and large scale is still an imperfect science but we are getting better at it regularly while we are also working to decrease our reliance on the oceans. At the same time we need to control some populations and monitor others so we can actually figure out which fish we need to worry about most and let other ones recover. Some populations of fish die off regularly because their population booms and they eat all the food in their spawning areas making the next spawning period have a sharp drop in the population. Salmon in BC are an example as one of the major issues was that there were too many fish in a small area and they simply could not support the population.

Jeff, where are you getting this bullshit from - The Ecorapists Monthly? Sure populations will grow and decline in response to environmental factors. And if we were smart we would reduce our catch when populations are low, not blame predators who will crash right along with a prey population.

We do, when salmon populations crashed we banned the fishing of that species until it recovered and we are now starting it again. How can we be expected to know when a population has crashed to that point if they spawn in an ocean? We use commercial fishing because they are willing to do it and pay taxes instead of us having to pay taxes to monitor the entire ocean. If a population crashes we work to protect them but the only method we have of measuring their population is the guys on the boat telling us it takes an extra month to catch what they used to. Same goes for whales, if the whalers started hitting their quota and it was never raised and they started going later and later we would know populations are in decline, if they finish faster then we know they are rising. Using that information we can react and limit or ban the fishing.

[andyt]

OK. You have a point. I'm against whaling, but there's really no moral or environmental argument against it - as long as it's done responsibly. When you start hearing how whales are decimating the fish stocks, tho, your bullshit detector should spring up. It's humans that are decimating the fish stocks. I'm not sure I buy your argument that whalers are not taking their quota because of harassment of enviros either - I bet it's because the whale pops they are hunting are not as abundant as they would claim,

[jeff744]

andyt andyt:

OK. You have a point. I'm against whaling, but there's really no moral or environmental argument against it - as long as it's done responsibly. When you start hearing how whales are decimating the fish stocks, tho, your bullshit detector should spring up. It's humans that are decimating the fish stocks. I'm not sure I buy your argument that whalers are not taking their quota because of harassment of enviros either - I bet it's because the whale pops they are hunting are not as abundant as they would claim,

The Japanese were 70% under their quota and ended the season far earlier than normal, the Sea Shepherd has been using what would be considered criminal acts in any country to prevent it, including throwing acid at sailors, causing injury. What is horrid is that these people are treated as heroes by many despite the fact they violate marine law regularly and have knowingly ignored distress signals and sunk ships. When a ship is constantly having cables sent towards its props and acid thrown on their catch and the people doing their job, it is hard to meet a quota.

[ShepherdsDog]

Since you're looking to focus your attention on the minke, as a culprit for destroying fish stock

$1:

In the Southern Hemisphere, krill constitutes the majority of the diet for the Antarctic species, and krill and myctophid fish for the dwarf form.

Yup, they're guilty of heavy predation on the commercial species of fish we depend on. And, as pointed out, there were plenty of fish when whale numbers were exponentially larger. Humans are the only ones guilty of decimating fish stock, not the cetaceans.

[Gunnair]

andyt andyt:

OK. You have a point. I'm against whaling, but there's really no moral or environmental argument against it - as long as it's done responsibly. When you start hearing how whales are decimating the fish stocks, tho, your bullshit detector should spring up. It's humans that are decimating the fish stocks. I'm not sure I buy your argument that whalers are not taking their quota because of harassment of enviros either - I bet it's because the whale pops they are hunting are not as abundant as they would claim,

Frankly, there's no good argument for it. The meat is considered a delicacy and has all the moral repugnance of using bear gallbladders and rhino horn to get a fucking hard on.

There really is no good reason for hunting whales anymore.

[jeff744]

Gunnair Gunnair:

andyt andyt:

OK. You have a point. I'm against whaling, but there's really no moral or environmental argument against it - as long as it's done responsibly. When you start hearing how whales are decimating the fish stocks, tho, your bullshit detector should spring up. It's humans that are decimating the fish stocks. I'm not sure I buy your argument that whalers are not taking their quota because of harassment of enviros either - I bet it's because the whale pops they are hunting are not as abundant as they would claim,

Frankly, there's no good argument for it. The meat is considered a delicacy and has all the moral repugnance of using bear gallbladders and rhino horn to get a fucking hard on.

There really is no good reason for hunting whales anymore.

You just gave one right there.

[Gunnair]

jeff744 jeff744:

Gunnair Gunnair:

andyt andyt:

OK. You have a point. I'm against whaling, but there's really no moral or environmental argument against it - as long as it's done responsibly. When you start hearing how whales are decimating the fish stocks, tho, your bullshit detector should spring up. It's humans that are decimating the fish stocks. I'm not sure I buy your argument that whalers are not taking their quota because of harassment of enviros either - I bet it's because the whale pops they are hunting are not as abundant as they would claim,

Frankly, there's no good argument for it. The meat is considered a delicacy and has all the moral repugnance of using bear gallbladders and rhino horn to get a fucking hard on.

There really is no good reason for hunting whales anymore.

You just gave one right there.

In your opinion. Meat as a delicacy is not, in my opinion, a worthwhile reason to kill a whale.

Fascinating as a society we wring our hands when it comes to executing child raping kiddie murderers but killing animals for a special kind of burger or for a hard on is a-okay.

[jeff744]

Gunnair Gunnair:

In your opinion. Meat as a delicacy is not, in my opinion, a worthwhile reason to kill a whale.

Fascinating as a society we wring our hands when it comes to executing child raping kiddie murderers but killing animals for a special kind of burger or for a hard on is a-okay.

Using the same argument all we should eat for meat is cows or pigs since they aren't special, wait, they involve killing animals too, guess we all have to go vegan.

[Gunnair]

jeff744 jeff744:

Gunnair Gunnair:

In your opinion. Meat as a delicacy is not, in my opinion, a worthwhile reason to kill a whale.

Fascinating as a society we wring our hands when it comes to executing child raping kiddie murderers but killing animals for a special kind of burger or for a hard on is a-okay.

Using the same argument all we should eat for meat is cows or pigs since they aren't special, wait, they involve killing animals too, guess we all have to go vegan.

Your either being obtuse or argumentative simply to troll.

[jeff744]

Gunnair Gunnair:

jeff744 jeff744:

Gunnair Gunnair:

In your opinion. Meat as a delicacy is not, in my opinion, a worthwhile reason to kill a whale.

Fascinating as a society we wring our hands when it comes to executing child raping kiddie murderers but killing animals for a special kind of burger or for a hard on is a-okay.

Using the same argument all we should eat for meat is cows or pigs since they aren't special, wait, they involve killing animals too, guess we all have to go vegan.

Your either being obtuse or argumentative simply to troll.

What makes them different? One is considered special? Are we not allowed to kill animals based on their taste ranking?

[Gunnair]

jeff744 jeff744:

Gunnair Gunnair:

jeff744 jeff744:

Using the same argument all we should eat for meat is cows or pigs since they aren't special, wait, they involve killing animals too, guess we all have to go vegan.

Your either being obtuse or argumentative simply to troll.

What makes them different? One is considered special? Are we not allowed to kill animals based on their taste ranking?

I've already said I'm going to avoid telling the trolling idiots of the forum to fuck off on a regular basis. Go be Eureka somewhere else.

[jeff744]

Gunnair Gunnair:

I've already said I'm going to avoid telling the trolling idiots of the forum to fuck off on a regular basis. Go be Eureka somewhere else.

You are saying that whales are special because they are considered a delicacy, lots of animals are considered a delicacy but we still kill them. All you are doing is trying to force your own moral view onto another group because you view it as morally repulsive, not all cultures have the same view on things. I am just pointing out that the same moral values can be turned on your dinner too because some view eating any meat as morally repulsive.