[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Oh Zip....you cannot be this politically naive.

I'm not that politically naive. As testament to this I cite thousands of posts here on hundreds of far-reaching political issues over several years. Interesting that you would, in spite of that, dismiss my comments as political naivety.

Politics--elections--are all about creating storylines that resonate with people. That's why it's so important for candidates, for example, to stick to the party line--because they are trying to sell a certain story to the public, and coherence and consistency are vital components to storytelling. It's a tale of competing stories, and which one people believe more.

You're just so caught up in your partisan mindset, you'd rather simply dismiss any conflicting viewpoints with questionable claims (Zip is politically naive) and outright denial ("It just isn't").

Zip, I dismiss your comments for a variety of reasons mainly because I've been involved in political campaigns for the last 20+ years. I've knocked on thousands of doors and been to endless amounts of Town Halls and open debates.

I have never, ever, heard anyone tell me that they didn't like a candidate because they were a "control freak"; not even when they were discussing the other candidates.

You think that because you find Harper's personality to be too controlling that it's an election issue. That's being both naive and partisan and shows that you're out of touch to what matters to voters.

[Zipperfish]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Zip, I dismiss your comments for a variety of reasons mainly because I've been involved in political campaigns for the last 20+ years. I've knocked on thousands of doors and been to endless amounts of Town Halls and open debates.

I have never, ever, heard anyone tell me that they didn't like a candidate because they were a "control freak"; not even when they were discussing the other candidates.

You think that because you find Harper's personality to be too controlling that it's an election issue. That's being both naive and partisan and shows that you're out of touch to what matters to voters.

For the record it's not just that I think Harper is a hyper-partisan control freak. That is the story I see coming from the opposition when I read the papers. That is the narrative they are creating.

Here's one from Andrew Coyne in today's National Post for example. Note the words he uses: Autocratic. Sullen. Bullying.

This is the story that the opposition is trying to construct. You may declare with utmost confidence and authority that it will not work. My own experience is to be wary of people who make far-reaching definitive statements with absolute confidence. The next election is a long way away, and there's a lot of water to go under the bridge before we get there.

[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

This is the story that the opposition is trying to construct. You may declare with utmost confidence and authority that it will not work. My own experience is to be wary of people who make far-reaching definitive statements with absolute confidence. The next election is a long way away, and there's a lot of water to go under the bridge before we get there.

If the opposition intends to run with this as an issue, it's no surprise why they're typically relegated to 3rd place unless the Liberals or CPC shit the bed. Awful strategy not worth wasting time on.

Among the top issues for Canadians, Harpers controlling personality isn't even on the radar. Focus on the greed of Duffy and other Conservative issues that actually matter to Canadians and can define a party and leader in a negative manor.

I guess the left hasn't yet realized that taking the angle of 'control freak with a hidden agenda' just doesn't work. They need some new material.

[Zipperfish]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

I guess the left hasn't yet realized that taking the angle of 'control freak with a hidden agenda' just doesn't work.

Well, it is working, right now anyway.

[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

I guess the left hasn't yet realized that taking the angle of 'control freak with a hidden agenda' just doesn't work.

Well, it is working, right now anyway.

How so?

Is Harper's popularity dropping? Is this an issue that has Canadians talking?

[Zipperfish]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

I guess the left hasn't yet realized that taking the angle of 'control freak with a hidden agenda' just doesn't work.

Well, it is working, right now anyway.

How so?

Is Harper's popularity dropping? Is this an issue that has Canadians talking?

Asked and answered OTL. Remember last time, when you said this PMO business wasn't even "on the radar" and I provided six major media stories dealing exactly with the PMO's hand in the Trudeau charity scandal. That was Page 7 of this thread.

You're going around in circles.

To quote Blackadder Goes Forth: "If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through."

[FieryVulpine]

Well, I noted how Glen McGregor had this information since February earlier in this thread, which he used to praise Justin for his "transparency." Methinks the major mainstream outlets wanted the potential conflict of interest to stay buried but the PMO "leaked" the information they already had to force them to acknowledge Mr. Trudeau's improprieties.

[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

You're going around in circles.

To quote Blackadder Goes Forth: "If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through."

So because people are talking about it, it works? You don't know if anything actually "worked" until election day.

We're back to you being naive, once again. You have this illusion that because you or some random political reporter in Canada speaks about a certain issue, that it means it's "on the radar" of Canadians. It's on the radar of political people (like you and I) and a handful of media from around the Country.

To Mr. & Mrs. Canada....this angle you're trying to push is a miserable failure. It started back in 2005, it's time for another approach.

Speaking of pigheaded & facts, how many times do you and the left have to push an agenda before you realise it really doesn't work?

[Zipperfish]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

So because people are talking about it, it works? You don't know if anything actually "worked" until election day.

We're back to you being naive, once again. You have this illusion that because you or some random political reporter in Canada speaks about a certain issue, that it means it's "on the radar" of Canadians. It's on the radar of political people (like you and I) and a handful of media from around the Country.

To Mr. & Mrs. Canada....this angle you're trying to push is a miserable failure. It started back in 2005, it's time for another approach.

Speaking of pigheaded & facts, how many times do you and the left have to push an agenda before you realise it really doesn't work?

You are just not making any sense at all. according to OTL, what Trudeau did was a big deal because--look!--it's in all the papers ("horrible optics" was the term you used). But the fact that all the papers also reported that the entire controversey was stage-managed out of the PMO is no big deal--"Mr and Mrs Canada" don't care. Two completely opposing viewpoints that you hold simultaneously.

The cognitive dissonance that must have to be in place to maintain your rabid partisanship is pretty staggering to behold.

[OnTheIce]

Your material is as old, stale and ineffective as this current agenda your trying to push. Total pot/kettle.

[Zipperfish]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Your material is as old, stale and ineffective as this current agenda your trying to push. Total pot/kettle.

Nice concession speech.

[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Your material is as old, stale and ineffective as this current agenda your trying to push. Total pot/kettle.

Nice concession speech.

I've yet to see anyone offer a concession speech to you. Never worthy. Your amazing political savvy is just awe inspiring.

[Zipperfish]

[quote="OnTheIceYour amazing political savvy is just awe inspiring. [/quote]

It's not bad.

You seem at a loss for words. Maybe a good time to drop by the CPC website and get your next instructions.

[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

You seem at a loss for words. Maybe a good time to drop by the CPC website and get your next instructions.

Loss for words? Hardly. Just tired of talking politics with someone with such a miniature amount of experience and knowledge on the subject complied with an epic amount of hypocrisy.

[Zipperfish]

And today...

National Post: PMO sends phony protesters to Trudeau appearance in another display of amateur hour

$1:

One of the most effective tools against bullying is laughter. And the PMO has opened itself to ready mockery. The next MP faced with a saucy PMO handler might be wise to paddle his bottom and send him on his way