[Brenda]

sandorski sandorski:

Not that it was necessary, but now that this has been done I expect no one to ever claim that Muslims never condemn the nonsense perpetrated by Terrorists again. I suspect some will though, for them it will be "Fail" with no explanation.

Exactly.
They just are not all bad...

[EyeBrock]

We just need more Muslims to stand up and challenge the jihadi arse holes. At the moment these guys going against the grain are a tiny minority.

[Goober_McGee]

Brenda Brenda:

Moderates DO stand up against fundamentalists.

About friggin time

sandorski sandorski:

Not that it was necessary, but now that this has been done I expect no one to ever claim that Muslims never condemn the nonsense perpetrated by Terrorists again. I suspect some will though, for them it will be "Fail" with no explanation.

It was necessary, very necessary, and it will continue to be necessary for "moderate" Muslims to speak out publicly against fundamentalism and terrorism if they want to be accepted at all in the West. As for your second point, someone who isn't fully informed on an issue will always shoot their mouth off.

[Brenda]

Goober_McGee Goober_McGee:

Brenda Brenda:

Moderates DO stand up against fundamentalists.

About friggin time

"they" have been since as long as I remember. But those were just the "(wo)men on the street". I guess they are not important.

[ManifestDestiny]

Bet you its a scam! and watch as your goverment gives them money, and they then support terrorists with your money!

[Goober_McGee]

Brenda Brenda:

Goober_McGee Goober_McGee:

Brenda Brenda:

Moderates DO stand up against fundamentalists.

About friggin time

"they" have been since as long as I remember. But those were just the "(wo)men on the street". I guess they are not important.

To be honest, in the grand scheme of things they aren't. They're just individuals expressing an opinion. Don't get me wrong it's great that they have been expressing this opinion, but politically speaking it doesn't amount to much until there is a large unified expression of said belief/opinion which shows all the individuals that there is a credible alternative to the fundamentalist perspectives.

just my two cents I guess.

[Freakinoldguy]

Talk is cheap and at this point that's all this fatwa is. As the matter of fact depending on the sect of muslim it may not even be binding.

What we need to see from these clerics is an honest effort to feret out the radicals and expose them before they can carry out any malicious actions.

Until they start turning terrorist and radicals in, I'll reserve judgement on the effectiveness of their fatwa's.

[sandorski]

Goober_McGee Goober_McGee:

Brenda Brenda:

Moderates DO stand up against fundamentalists.

About friggin time

sandorski sandorski:

Not that it was necessary, but now that this has been done I expect no one to ever claim that Muslims never condemn the nonsense perpetrated by Terrorists again. I suspect some will though, for them it will be "Fail" with no explanation.

It was necessary, very necessary, and it will continue to be necessary for "moderate" Muslims to speak out publicly against fundamentalism and terrorism if they want to be accepted at all in the West. As for your second point, someone who isn't fully informed on an issue will always shoot their mouth off.

No, it really wasn't as far as the point I was making is concerned.

[BeaverFever]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

We just need more Muslims to stand up and challenge the jihadi arse holes. At the moment these guys going against the grain are a tiny minority.

No, they're not a minority at all. The extremist terrorists are the minority, they just get good PR through sensationalist western media and the fact that most westerners have never met any muslims. Think about it: if the majority of the worlds 1 billion muslims were terrorists, the western world would like Mad Max post-apocalypse world by nhow, instead of just a handful of attacks (half of them botched) carried out by a handful of people over the course of a decade. Bombs would be going off in our cities several times a day instead of one attempt every few years or so by three or four idiots that learned to make bombs from wikipedia.

I could make the world think all North Americans were KKK members if thats all I showed on TV 24 hours a day for over a decade.

[BeaverFever]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Talk is cheap and at this point that's all this fatwa is. As the matter of fact depending on the sect of muslim it may not even be binding.

What we need to see from these clerics is an honest effort to feret out the radicals and expose them before they can carry out any malicious actions.

Until they start turning terrorist and radicals in, I'll reserve judgement on the effectiveness of their fatwa's.

You mean like the two RCMP informants who were part of the so-called "Toronto 18" cell (one of which was a muslim community leader)?

Or the thousands of Afghan and Iraqis fighting on 'our' side of those wars?

The evidence you seek is all around us, some just choose to ignore it or quickly forget it for some reason or another.

You're right about one thing though, as far as I know, there's no such thing as a 'binding' fatwa. Im pretty sure its just a declaration of beliefs. Anybody who didnt agree with it would just go find themselves a different mosque that is not affiliated with this group.

[Freakinoldguy]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Talk is cheap and at this point that's all this fatwa is. As the matter of fact depending on the sect of muslim it may not even be binding.

What we need to see from these clerics is an honest effort to feret out the radicals and expose them before they can carry out any malicious actions.

Until they start turning terrorist and radicals in, I'll reserve judgement on the effectiveness of their fatwa's.

You mean like the two RCMP informants who were part of the so-called "Toronto 18" cell (one of which was a muslim community leader)?

Or the thousands of Afghan and Iraqis fighting on 'our' side of those wars?

The evidence you seek is all around us, some just choose to ignore it or quickly forget it for some reason or another.

You're right about one thing though, as far as I know, there's no such thing as a 'binding' fatwa. Im pretty sure its just a declaration of beliefs. Anybody who didnt agree with it would just go find themselves a different mosque that is not affiliated with this group.

Certainly you have a group of Muslims who have allied themselves with us, but they are a definate minority when it comes to stopping the radicalizing of Muslim youth.

Other than this instance can you come up with one case where a Muslim religous leader actually spoke out against the radical side of Islam, before an act of terrorism was perpetrated?

Most times you hear from them is after the fact and then it's only to say all the right things to try and deflect criticism from all Muslims, which is understandable.

While it's nice to see some of them comming out against terrorism, I remain sceptical that this fatwa will do anything to stop current events. Maybe if they'd declared it a Jihad against terrorism, I'd have been a little more believing.

[Scape]

The author of this email is said to be Dr. Emanuel Tanay, a well-known and
well-respected psychiatrist.


A German's View on Islam


A man, whose family was German aristocracy prior to World War II,
owned a number of large industries and estates. When asked how many
German people were true Nazis, the answer he gave can guide our attitude
toward fanaticism.
'Very few people were true Nazis,' he said, 'but many enjoyed the return
of German pride, and many more were too busy to care. I was one of those
who just thought the Nazis were a bunch of fools. So, the majority just
sat back and let it all happen. Then, before we knew it, they owned us,
and we had lost control, and the end of the world had come. My family
lost everything. I ended up in a concentration camp and the Allies
destroyed my factories.'


We are told again and again by 'experts' and 'talking heads' that
Islam is the religion of peace and that the vast majority of Muslims
just want to live in peace. Although this unqualified assertion may be
true, it is entirely irrelevant. It is meaningless fluff, meant to make
us feel better, and meant to somehow diminish the spectre of fanatics
rampaging across the globe in the name of Islam.


The fact is that the fanatics rule Islam at this moment in history. It
is the fanatics who march. It is the fanatics who wage any one of 50
shooting wars worldwide. It is the fanatics who systematically slaughter
Christian or tribal groups throughout Africa and are gradually taking
over the entire continent in an Islamic wave. It is the fanatics who
bomb, behead, murder, or honour-kill. It is the fanatics who take over
mosque after mosque. It is the fanatics who zealously spread the stoning
and hanging of rape victims and homosexuals. It is the fanatics who
teach their young to kill and to become suicide bombers.


The hard, quantifiable fact is that the peaceful majority, the 'silent
majority,' is cowed and extraneous.


Communist Russia was comprised of Russians who just wanted to live in
peace, yet the Russian Communists were responsible for the murder of
about 20 million people. The peaceful majority were irrelevant.. China's
huge population was peaceful as well, but Chinese Communists managed to
kill a staggering 70 million people.


The average Japanese individual prior to World War II was not a
warmongering sadist. Yet, Japan murdered and slaughtered its way across
South East Asia in an orgy of killing that included the systematic
murder of 12 million Chinese civilians; most killed by sword, shovel,
and bayonet.


And who can forget Rwanda, which collapsed into butchery. Could it not
be said that the majority of Rwandans were 'peace loving'?


History lessons are often incredibly simple and blunt, yet for all our
powers of reason, we often miss the most basic and uncomplicated of
points:


Peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence.


Peace-loving Muslims will become our enemy if they don't speak up,
because like my friend from Germany, they will awaken one day and find
that the fanatics own them, and the end of their world will have begun.


Peace-loving Germans, Japanese, Chinese, Russians, Rwandans, Serbs,
Afghans, Iraqis, Palestinians, Somalis, Nigerians, Algerians, and many
others have died because the peaceful majority did not speak up until it
was too late.
As for us who watch it all unfold, we must pay attention to the only
group that counts--the fanatics who threaten our way of life.

[Gunnair]

ManifestDestiny ManifestDestiny:

Bet you its a scam! and watch as your goverment gives them money, and they then support terrorists with your money!

Add that to the long list of your posted, worthless opinions...

[EyeBrock]

Scape Scape:

The author of this email is said to be Dr. Emanuel Tanay, a well-known and
well-respected psychiatrist.


A German's View on Islam


A man, whose family was German aristocracy prior to World War II,
owned a number of large industries and estates. When asked how many
German people were true Nazis, the answer he gave can guide our attitude
toward fanaticism.
'Very few people were true Nazis,' he said, 'but many enjoyed the return
of German pride, and many more were too busy to care. I was one of those
who just thought the Nazis were a bunch of fools. So, the majority just
sat back and let it all happen. Then, before we knew it, they owned us,
and we had lost control, and the end of the world had come. My family
lost everything. I ended up in a concentration camp and the Allies
destroyed my factories.'


We are told again and again by 'experts' and 'talking heads' that
Islam is the religion of peace and that the vast majority of Muslims
just want to live in peace. Although this unqualified assertion may be
true, it is entirely irrelevant. It is meaningless fluff, meant to make
us feel better, and meant to somehow diminish the spectre of fanatics
rampaging across the globe in the name of Islam.


The fact is that the fanatics rule Islam at this moment in history. It
is the fanatics who march. It is the fanatics who wage any one of 50
shooting wars worldwide. It is the fanatics who systematically slaughter
Christian or tribal groups throughout Africa and are gradually taking
over the entire continent in an Islamic wave. It is the fanatics who
bomb, behead, murder, or honour-kill. It is the fanatics who take over
mosque after mosque. It is the fanatics who zealously spread the stoning
and hanging of rape victims and homosexuals. It is the fanatics who
teach their young to kill and to become suicide bombers.


The hard, quantifiable fact is that the peaceful majority, the 'silent
majority,' is cowed and extraneous.


Communist Russia was comprised of Russians who just wanted to live in
peace, yet the Russian Communists were responsible for the murder of
about 20 million people. The peaceful majority were irrelevant.. China's
huge population was peaceful as well, but Chinese Communists managed to
kill a staggering 70 million people.


The average Japanese individual prior to World War II was not a
warmongering sadist. Yet, Japan murdered and slaughtered its way across
South East Asia in an orgy of killing that included the systematic
murder of 12 million Chinese civilians; most killed by sword, shovel,
and bayonet.


And who can forget Rwanda, which collapsed into butchery. Could it not
be said that the majority of Rwandans were 'peace loving'?


History lessons are often incredibly simple and blunt, yet for all our
powers of reason, we often miss the most basic and uncomplicated of
points:


Peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence.


Peace-loving Muslims will become our enemy if they don't speak up,
because like my friend from Germany, they will awaken one day and find
that the fanatics own them, and the end of their world will have begun.


Peace-loving Germans, Japanese, Chinese, Russians, Rwandans, Serbs,
Afghans, Iraqis, Palestinians, Somalis, Nigerians, Algerians, and many
others have died because the peaceful majority did not speak up until it
was too late.
As for us who watch it all unfold, we must pay attention to the only
group that counts--the fanatics who threaten our way of life.

You are on a roll Scape. Another good find and a good post.

[ManifestDestiny]

Gunnair Gunnair:

ManifestDestiny ManifestDestiny:

Bet you its a scam! and watch as your goverment gives them money, and they then support terrorists with your money!

Add that to the long list of your posted, worthless opinions...

yeah sure