[BartSimpson]

camerontech camerontech:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

If the weather is bad enough you need to put on tire chains. Snow tires are fine in a light snow, but in anything serious you need chains.

chains are illegal in almost all of ontario, the only places where they are legal is northwestern ontario (yeah, we kick ass) and on dirt roads. they're great for control but they wreak havoc on pavement if there's not enough snow on the ground

"Not enough snow" is not often a problem in the Sierra Mountains a few klicks from here. In 1952 there was a record thirty one meter snowfall from just one storm and, even now, a two meter snowfall over night is considered a decent - but not heavy - snowfall.

If you head into the mountains between Sept 1 and May 30 it's a wise idea to bring chains.

[ziggy]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

camerontech camerontech:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

If the weather is bad enough you need to put on tire chains. Snow tires are fine in a light snow, but in anything serious you need chains.

chains are illegal in almost all of ontario, the only places where they are legal is northwestern ontario (yeah, we kick ass) and on dirt roads. they're great for control but they wreak havoc on pavement if there's not enough snow on the ground

"Not enough snow" is not often a problem in the Sierra Mountains a few klicks from here. In 1952 there was a record thirty one meter snowfall from just one storm and, even now, a two meter snowfall over night is considered a decent - but not heavy - snowfall.

If you head into the mountains between Sept 1 and May 30 it's a wise idea to bring chains.

31 meters? Dude,that's allmost 100 feet,hope you got a link for that info,here in Canada records go back to about 1947 so you should be able to dig something up.

[romanP]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

If the weather is bad enough you need to put on tire chains. Snow tires are fine in a light snow, but in anything serious you need chains.

I'm pretty sure tire chains are illegal on city roads, because they damage the road.

[Kiajeffrey]

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

sasquatch2 sasquatch2:

I have only recently finally parked my '87 fire-chicken.

Interesting! My '87 fire-chicken has been parked for a few years. I should get around to selling it. I was great in summer, but slid badly in winter. I had to shovel the back lane behind my garage all the way down to pavement. Otherwise I would get stuck. It created a lip in the packed snow either side of my property until a front-end loader scraped the back lane; probably someone complained. But if I didn't shovel, my car would either dig in or get stuck in the ruts.

When I lived in Toronto, a couple times after a blizzard traffic was ridiculously sparse on highway 401. I lived in North York but worked in Markham, drove backwards to most traffic. In the morning after a blizzard I would see one car on the horizon in front of me, one on the horizon behind. I had 4 lanes to myself. Good thing since the car drove at a 30° angle in deep snow. Seriously; imagine driving with the front-right corner leading. I needed at least 2 lanes to myself, good thing I had all 4.

If I tried to start moving in a snow drift 4" or more deep the rear end would slide straight to the right until the vehicle was at a 30° angle, then start moving forward. One time in a parking lot I hit a dumpster when the rear end moved sideways into it. Luckily the dent came out without leaving a scratch in the paint.

During summer the fire-chicken drove great. I could drive highway 401 in summer at 140 km/h with no trouble. Necessary when traffic often cruised at 120 km/h. The 400 class highways are built for 120 km/h, I have no idea why the posted speed limit is only 100. I put the petal to the metal once soon after I bought it; on the perimeter highway in Winnipeg in the middle of the night when no one was on the highway. It pegged out the speedometer, but judging by the distance from the last graduation to the peg and how much it accelerated after it pegged out, I drove at 163 km/h. At that speed steering got insanely sensitive; a small movement of the steering wheel would throw you to one side. But up to 140 km/h it drove smooth. Obviously I didn't have either of the V8 engines, or the sport suspension package. The point is it's a summer car.

I have an Aztek now with all wheel drive. I got tired of getting stuck in winter, this vehicle may not accelerate like a sports car but it never gets stuck in snow. It's a small SUV; actually Pontiac class it a Sport Recreational Vehicle. It's based on a minivan rather than a pickup truck. But it also gets better fuel economy than my fire-chicken. And room to haul stuff. I was able to pack camping and sporting equipment (at once) in my fire-chicken, but the SUV has plenty of room.

So how would winter tires perform when some streets are plowed and salted down to pavement, and others aren't? When would I put them on? The first real snow came this weekend, unusually late for Winnipeg. It's better to have good all seasons and just leave them on all the time.

The biggest problem with "all season" tires is that the rubber compound(synthetic - cheap) they use to make them turns to slate as soon as it gets a few degrees below zero. It is all about traction on that film the plows leave behind when they run the snow oFf the roads. That skim will freeze to a sheet of ice in no time, especially if there is no traffic and if uou do not have the proper tires and the proper attitude you are toast.

There are good wuality all season tires out there that are made of the right compound, are rated for snow and even have mileage guarantee - but you won't find them at Costco or Canadian Tire!

[Numure]

Its already the norm here. Change tires in November, and put Summer Tires on in spring. Most people can usually make them last 4-5 years. Its not a waste of money. And it IS safer.

Try driving on a snowed out road with all-season tires, the back of your car will spend its time going left and right. With winter tires, it doesnt happen.

[Winnipegger]

Kiajeffrey Kiajeffrey:

The biggest problem with "all season" tires is that the rubber compound(synthetic - cheap) they use to make them turns to slate as soon as it gets a few degrees below zero. It is all about traction on that film the plows leave behind when they run the snow oFf the roads. That skim will freeze to a sheet of ice in no time, especially if there is no traffic and if uou do not have the proper tires and the proper attitude you are toast.

There are good wuality all season tires out there that are made of the right compound, are rated for snow and even have mileage guarantee - but you won't find them at Costco or Canadian Tire!

I have Dunlop "Triple Tread" tires on my Aztek, from a dedicated tire store.

I don't know what you mean by a film the plows leave. Here in Winnipeg it gets cold, today is the first cold winter day, it was -22°C. The plows leave a film of snow, not water. In fact they don't even use road salt in Winnipeg, it's too cold for salt to work most of winter. They spread sand instead.

[ziggy]

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

Kiajeffrey Kiajeffrey:

The biggest problem with "all season" tires is that the rubber compound(synthetic - cheap) they use to make them turns to slate as soon as it gets a few degrees below zero. It is all about traction on that film the plows leave behind when they run the snow oFf the roads. That skim will freeze to a sheet of ice in no time, especially if there is no traffic and if uou do not have the proper tires and the proper attitude you are toast.

There are good wuality all season tires out there that are made of the right compound, are rated for snow and even have mileage guarantee - but you won't find them at Costco or Canadian Tire!

I have Dunlop "Triple Tread" tires on my Aztek, from a dedicated tire store.

I don't know what you mean by a film the plows leave. Here in Winnipeg it gets cold, today is the first cold winter day, it was -22°C. The plows leave a film of snow, not water. In fact they don't even use road salt in Winnipeg, it's too cold for salt to work most of winter. They spread sand instead.

Snowplows have runners along the blade that keep them a few cm's off the pavement,they cant scrape to the ashphalt like a grader can.

[ziggy]

And no matter what kind of tires you have the colder it is outside the better traction you will have.Roads and ice are at their slipperiest when near melting temps.

[Kiajeffrey]

ziggy ziggy:

And no matter what kind of tires you have the colder it is outside the better traction you will have.Roads and ice are at their slipperiest when near melting temps.

Sorry, have to disagree. Traction is all about friction. I am not a physics expert but I think it is safe to assume that when too surfaces meet the more resistance there is the more friction results. Water actually has more surface drag? than ice. When there is water or sluch on the roads it actually causes an effect clled hydroplaning. Simply put poor quality tires cant't move the water and slush away from the tire surface fast enough and therefore the rubber never meets the road, thus less friction.

The synthetics the tire manufacturers use today are of three types.
The first type includes a silica compound which stays soft in the cold therefore creating better friction co-efficient.
The second is good for most uses, but surrounded by tons of leading advertising and hype.
The third is just the cheapest way to make them, usually for housebrand tires either made on China or Dayton, Ohio.

[ziggy]

Kiajeffrey Kiajeffrey:

ziggy ziggy:

And no matter what kind of tires you have the colder it is outside the better traction you will have.Roads and ice are at their slipperiest when near melting temps.

Sorry, have to disagree. Traction is all about friction. I am not a physics expert but I think it is safe to assume that when too surfaces meet the more resistance there is the more friction results. Water actually has more surface drag? than ice. When there is water or sluch on the roads it actually causes an effect clled hydroplaning. Simply put poor quality tires cant't move the water and slush away from the tire surface fast enough and therefore the rubber never meets the road, thus less friction.

The synthetics the tire manufacturers use today are of three types.
The first type includes a silica compound which stays soft in the cold therefore creating better friction co-efficient.
The second is good for most uses, but surrounded by tons of leading advertising and hype.
The third is just the cheapest way to make them, usually for housebrand tires either made on China or Dayton, Ohio.

Ice causes slippery roads,warm temps cause snow under a tire to turn to ice,this doesnt happen at colder temps.Anyone who lives in chinook country will verify this.Anyone who drives truck in winter conditions should also be able to verify this.

[Numure]

They use Calcium based sand here, on our roads.

[ziggy]

Numure Numure:

They use Calcium based sand here, on our roads.

They switched to potash here,either one is useless after a certain temperature.

[Numure]

hurley_108 hurley_108:

And that's not even going into the argument of the government legislating personal behaviours.

That's rediculous. Just as bad as saying their shouldnt be any speed limits.

If someone looses control of their vehicle because they have bad tires, what do you think will happen? They will crash into another vehicle. Possibly killing someone.

[Numure]

ziggy ziggy:

Numure Numure:

They use Calcium based sand here, on our roads.

They switched to potash here,either one is useless after a certain temperature.

Yea. Usually when temperatures hit -30 to -40, alot of accidents happen. The roads get very icy.

[ziggy]

Numure Numure:

ziggy ziggy:

Numure Numure:

They use Calcium based sand here, on our roads.

They switched to potash here,either one is useless after a certain temperature.

Yea. Usually when temperatures hit -30 to -40, alot of accidents happen. The roads get very icy.

Ask any grader operator(like Alberta redneck) they are experts on when roads get icy.The warmer the slippier as ice needs to be melted first to become ice.