[andyt]

Strutz Strutz:

andyt andyt:

You've got to shake your head at what people will put in their bodies. I've had fentanyl, dilaudid and oxycontin after an operation. It wasn't any great whoop. (Maybe they don't give the the same dose that junkies take?) I don't get it, just left me feeling fuzzy brained, but didn't do all that much for pain. (Of course I don't know what the pain would have been like without it).

The people over dosing on fentanyl are mostly the recreational users, because that shit is being put in everything now. Insite found 80% of the drugs that users brought in for testing had fentanyl in it. So people who are not addicted are dying from this stuff - you'd think the word would be out by now.

And now comes this shit, 100 times more powerful than fentanyl. In the 70's I saw a hollywood bimbo talk about how they would take a drug called "Jerry Lewis' Kids" because it made you spastic like those kids. Where'e the fun in that? I don't get it.

What I don't get is why a dealer would put fentanyl into any other drug. I mean, if it is so deadly then the dealer is potentially killing his customers which would mean no repeat business from them. And speaking of which, what other drugs is fentanyl being put into? Cocaine? Heroin? Pot?

All of them, including ecstasy, which the kids like.

Fentanyl enhances the effects of the other drugs it is combined with, if you get the dose right. But the quality control the producers have isn't all that good, so you never know how much is in the drugs the users are taking. Fentanyl is also very cheap to make, so you get lots of bang for the buck. The makers don't care if a few people die, there's always more idiots out there that want to get high. The actual dealers have no clue what's actually in the drug they are selling.

If you read the story, there are actually some people who seek out this elephant drug, so we're not dealing with the sharpest knives in the drawer here. Anything for a high.

Again, most people dying here are recreational users who had no idea what they are getting and aren't prepared to deal with overdoses. So they are more the middle class types, and the kids.

[Delwin]

When addicts accidentally overdose on heroin, it is almost always because of what is known as "hot" hit. Opioids can be refined to be so potent that a single microgram of one isomer can be as
Potent as 10 mg of morphine. (See carfentanil.) or 10,000 times more potent. The more sloppy the refining process, the more difficult it becomes to isolate a single isomer.

In most cases I would think you would be adding the fetanyl to designer drugs or to heroin itself to improve its potency. The problem would be an inability to dilute the fetanyl properly and not so much an actual intent to kill people.

It wouldn't make sense to add it to coke since coke is an upper and opioids are downers.

I know in Canada fetanyl patches are prescribed to heroin addicts and they can recieve it for free. I've seen people scrape the patches and eat or smoke it. They look like nicotine patches. I think they distribute them at methadone clinics.

[llama66]

What is wrong with people?

[andyt]

Delwin Delwin:

When addicts accidentally overdose on heroin, it is almost always because of what is known as "hot" hit. Opioids can be refined to be so potent that a single microgram of one isomer can be as
Potent as 10 mg of morphine. (See carfentanil.) or 10,000 times more potent. The more sloppy the refining process, the more difficult it becomes to isolate a single isomer.

In most cases I would think you would be adding the fetanyl to designer drugs or to heroin itself to improve its potency. The problem would be an inability to dilute the fetanyl properly and not so much an actual intent to kill people.

It wouldn't make sense to add it to coke since coke is an upper and opioids are downers.

I know in Canada fetanyl patches are prescribed to heroin addicts and they can recieve it for free. I've sent people scrape the patches and eat or smoke it. They look like nicotine patches. I think they distribute them at methadone clinics.

No they're not trying to kill people, just don't care all that much. And they do add it to coke - guess it makes for a speedball effect. Same with ecstasy - not something you would expect an opioid in, but it's become very common. They'll also cure pot with it to add to the effect or make up for poor quality stuff. That is one reason recreational drug users are dying - they have not built up the tolerance of the regular users.

[Strutz]

Awful. Just awful.

The article mentions that even veterinarians have limited access to carfentanil, so how in hell is it getting out there? It's the same thing with other shit like this though I guess, there's always a way and a source for it. Sad.

[andyt]

fentanyl is mass produced in China. You can call up a manufacturer there and they'll ship it to you. Since this carfentanyl is a derivative, I guess they start with fentanyl and then just tweak it.

Globe and Mail said Canada has one of the highest prescription opioid rates in the world - we go running to the doctor for every little thing and they are pretty lax about prescribing it. Then people who were legitimately using them get addicted and turn to the street to keep getting their fix. And it's become a white people's drug. Heroin used to be mainly used by blacks. but now the poorer whites are using opioids like crazy. Just google fentanyl crisis if you want an eye opener.

And it doesn't take much:

$1:

Canadian border officials intercepted a one-kilogram package of carfentanil in June. It was bound for Calgary from China. "If you look at what one kilogram of carfentanil can produce, it's approximately 50 million fatal doses that could have hit our Canadian streets," said RCMP Insp. Allan Lai.

[BRAH]

andyt andyt:

fentanyl is mass produced in China. You can call up a manufacturer there and they'll ship it to you. Since this carfentanyl is a derivative, I guess they start with fentanyl and then just tweak it.

Globe and Mail said Canada has one of the highest prescription opioid rates in the world - we go running to the doctor for every little thing and they are pretty lax about prescribing it. Then people who were legitimately using them get addicted and turn to the street to keep getting their fix. And it's become a white people's drug. Heroin used to be mainly used by blacks. but now the poorer whites are using opioids like crazy. Just google fentanyl crisis if you want an eye opener.

And it doesn't take much:

$1:

Canadian border officials intercepted a one-kilogram package of carfentanil in June. It was bound for Calgary from China. "If you look at what one kilogram of carfentanil can produce, it's approximately 50 million fatal doses that could have hit our Canadian streets," said RCMP Insp. Allan Lai.

That's Scary Shit.

[andyt]

Customs won't open packages under 30 grams. That's enough to kill 1.5 million people.

[Delwin]

It is totally scary. Almost weapons grade scary. It actually provides a strong argument for the decriminalization IMO. When you can store a 100 year supply in film cannister. Good luck finding it. Better to just accept it as the problem it is and try to control it or give up and let Darwin do his work.

[Freakinoldguy]

andyt andyt:

Delwin Delwin:

When addicts accidentally overdose on heroin, it is almost always because of what is known as "hot" hit. Opioids can be refined to be so potent that a single microgram of one isomer can be as
Potent as 10 mg of morphine. (See carfentanil.) or 10,000 times more potent. The more sloppy the refining process, the more difficult it becomes to isolate a single isomer.

In most cases I would think you would be adding the fetanyl to designer drugs or to heroin itself to improve its potency. The problem would be an inability to dilute the fetanyl properly and not so much an actual intent to kill people.

It wouldn't make sense to add it to coke since coke is an upper and opioids are downers.

I know in Canada fetanyl patches are prescribed to heroin addicts and they can recieve it for free. I've sent people scrape the patches and eat or smoke it. They look like nicotine patches. I think they distribute them at methadone clinics.

No they're not trying to kill people, just don't care all that much. And they do add it to coke - guess it makes for a speedball effect. Same with ecstasy - not something you would expect an opioid in, but it's become very common. They'll also cure pot with it to add to the effect or make up for poor quality stuff. That is one reason recreational drug users are dying - they have not built up the tolerance of the regular users.

If what you say is true then this might just be an explanation of why more and more deaths are being seen in the non hardcore user category.

$1:

“What’s probably happening here is there’s a decrease of available prescription opioids in the marketplace, and organized crime is filling that market with fentanyl,” Dr. Young said.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/bri ... e25920303/

I'm just going to throw this out there but, the CMA's new stance on the over use of and subsequent near refusal to prescribe opiod pain meds for people genuinely in pain is likely a major reason we're seeing alot more non addict deaths from drugs laced with god knows what.

If you're in pain and someone says they have oxy or some other pain killer you'll take them up on the offer especially if that pill looks like it came out of someones medicine cabinet or was stolen from a pharmacy.

I can understand why the CMA doesn't want to continue to be enablers but, they have to revisit their policies on prescription drugs because it's one of the main reason unsuspecting people are dying.

Pain is a great motivator for doing stupid things and we're seeing the results.

[andyt]

Delwin Delwin:

It is totally scary. Almost weapons grade scary. It actually provides a strong argument for the decriminalization IMO. When you can store a 100 year supply in film cannister. Good luck finding it. Better to just accept it as the problem it is and try to control it or give up and let Darwin do his work.

Actually legalization and regulation would result in a lot less Darwin incidents. Most people don't want to take this shit, it's just mixed in with the drug they do want. Offer them a clean supply of say heroin or what have you, of known dosage, and there would be far fewer overdoses. We certainly can't say that criminalization has worked.

[raydan]

Sure, pain is one motivator, but addiction to pain killers (from legitimate prescriptions) is another.

[andyt]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

andyt andyt:

Delwin Delwin:

When addicts accidentally overdose on heroin, it is almost always because of what is known as "hot" hit. Opioids can be refined to be so potent that a single microgram of one isomer can be as
Potent as 10 mg of morphine. (See carfentanil.) or 10,000 times more potent. The more sloppy the refining process, the more difficult it becomes to isolate a single isomer.

In most cases I would think you would be adding the fetanyl to designer drugs or to heroin itself to improve its potency. The problem would be an inability to dilute the fetanyl properly and not so much an actual intent to kill people.

It wouldn't make sense to add it to coke since coke is an upper and opioids are downers.

I know in Canada fetanyl patches are prescribed to heroin addicts and they can recieve it for free. I've sent people scrape the patches and eat or smoke it. They look like nicotine patches. I think they distribute them at methadone clinics.

No they're not trying to kill people, just don't care all that much. And they do add it to coke - guess it makes for a speedball effect. Same with ecstasy - not something you would expect an opioid in, but it's become very common. They'll also cure pot with it to add to the effect or make up for poor quality stuff. That is one reason recreational drug users are dying - they have not built up the tolerance of the regular users.

If what you say is true then this might just be an explanation of why more and more deaths are being seen in the non hardcore user category.

$1:

“What’s probably happening here is there’s a decrease of available prescription opioids in the marketplace, and organized crime is filling that market with fentanyl,” Dr. Young said.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/bri ... e25920303/

I'm just going to throw this out there but, the CMA's new stance on the over use of and subsequent near refusal to prescribe opiod pain meds for people genuinely in pain is likely a major reason we're seeing alot more non addict deaths from drugs laced with god knows what.

If you're in pain and someone says they have oxy or some other pain killer you'll take them up on the offer especially if that pill looks like it came out of someones medicine cabinet or was stolen from a pharmacy.

I can understand why the CMA doesn't want to continue to be enablers but, they have to revisit their policies on prescription drugs because it's one of the main reason unsuspecting people are dying.

Pain is a great motivator for doing stupid things and we're seeing the results.

There is some to what you say, but I think what the doctor is talking about is that doctors have become more savvy in handing out prescriptions to people who don't need it. And oxycontin was changed so you can't grind it up and use it like heroin anymore. It does sound like the docs are swinging to the other extreme now, where people in pain have trouble getting legal opioids, but I think a lot more of this stuff is being taken by recreational users, rather than people in pain. And again, it's mixed in with drugs you wouldn't at all expect it to be, which catches people unawares.

[housewife]

But non of this is new there has always been people lacing street drugs with extras. It was part of my talk with my brother about drugs years ago. When my cuz died there were 14 different drugs in her system. She was doing some drug cocktail and that was almost 20 years ago. She was part of a large group of teen deaths drug related. The only thing that changes are the drugs and what it is being laced with.

[andyt]

Yes, but the drugs being used now are far more deadly. We've never had the number of overdose deaths we are seeing now. And your cousin may have been mixing the drugs herself, doubt anybody puts 14 drugs in one pill or powder. People have always mixed uppers and downers, and benzos and booze is a deadly combination.