[DrCaleb]

Lemmy Lemmy:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

But in Toronto, where they practice 'carding' it seems the people and the police aren't getting along too well.

It's more about parts of Toronto resembling urban USA (racially segregated, broken families, low-income, high crime rates and lots of guns) than it is about the carding, I'd say. But when you already mistrust the cops, carding is likely not going to help improve that.

I'm inclined to agree there. The only place in Edmonton where there seems to be a mistrust of the police tends to have the same conditions, but no carding. Yes, I'm looking at you 'Somali Community'.

[CDN_PATRIOT]

shockedcanadian shockedcanadian:

A quick google provided this definition

Unfortunately, Google couldn't tell me why you keep dodging my questions. Ah, the life of a hypocrite who can't face the truth.

C'est la vie.

-J.

[Jabberwalker]

Lemmy Lemmy:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

I have to wonder too if the adversarial nature of the Police vs the Public is part of the reason you guys are seeing so much backlash between the two. I don't recall ever feeling intimidated by police at large (just specific), and right now with the death of a local officer you can drive in parts of the city and every single pole or tree has a blue ribbon around it. So I think most people here feel that way too.

I think there are a lot of reasons why there's an adversarial conflict between police and the public in the USA. But two key factors are the proliferation of firearms and cops' salaries.
First, the proliferation of firearms means that any time the cops show up to investigate, they have to assume the public is armed. So interactions begin like a Mexican stand off. Naturally, the cops are on adrenaline. How could they not be?
Second, cops in the USA make, on average $45,000/yr. It's an immutable universal truth in labour economics that you get what you pay for. Who do you expect to attract to the job when you're offering $45K? Who would take on the job risk of being a cop in America for $45K? Answer: people who weigh the "perk" of getting to bully and beat people as compensation enough to make up for the shit pay.

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

But in Toronto, where they practice 'carding' it seems the people and the police aren't getting along too well.

It's more about parts of Toronto resembling urban USA (racially segregated, broken families, low-income, high crime rates and lots of guns) than it is about the carding, I'd say. But when you already mistrust the cops, carding is likely not going to help improve that.

Very few parts of Toronto, I mean almost none that have any resemblance at all to the no-go areas that you find in the decaying cities south of the border. Its just not like that, there. The north of Winnipeg is far worse that the worst the Toronto has to offer. Considering that Toronto is now that fourth largest urban area in North America, the crime rate is extremely low and it even measures low in comparison with most Canadian cities.

The carding thing now seems to be what the policeman's union wants and history here has shown that you can't go against them. They are moving out of civilian control (see G-20..

[BeaverFever]

Carding is also called "street checks" is practiced officially in many US and Canadian cities and probably unofficially in many more.

Officially, whether a citizen shows ID or not is "voluntary", legally you have the right to refuse. However it's your responsibility to know that as the cops likely won't tell you and even if they do, you probably will still feel like bad things will happen if you don't comply. Funny how that' happens when 2 or more cops step into your personal space with their chests all puffed out.

Not to mention that people have gotten their carding data under Freedom of Information and found it to be grossly inaccurate. One man found that he was recorded in their database as being BOTH 5'10 and 8' tall (he's neither) and even though he's born and raised here in Toronto, lived here his whole life, the database had him as born in Jamaica as possible deportation order.

More here:


http://m.thestar.com/#/article/news/gta ... ng_me.html

[Lemmy]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

Very few parts of Toronto, I mean almost none that have any resemblance at all to the no-go areas that you find in the decaying cities south of the border. Its just not like that, there. The north of Winnipeg is far worse that the worst the Toronto has to offer. Considering that Toronto is now that fourth largest urban area in North America, the crime rate is extremely low and it even measures low in comparison with most Canadian cities.

Sure, that's fair. Still, Malvern, Jane-Finch and Regent Park are definitely not places for white people to go walking around at night unless they're trying to get robbed. And if you tune in CP24, someone gets shot EVERY DAY in Toronto. True, that pales in comparison to a day in Washington or Detroit or New Orleans, but it's still much more dangerous on the streets of Toronto than it was even 10 years ago. Why? Guns.

[BartSimpson]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

Funny how that' happens when 2 or more cops step into your personal space with their chests all puffed out.

Try that with a cop and they'll kill you for it. But the bastards who pull this shit get away with it all the time.

[BeaverFever]

Lemmy Lemmy:

Regent Park are definitely not places for white people to go walking around at night unless they're trying to get robbed. And if you tune in CP24, someone gets shot EVERY DAY in Toronto. True, that pales in comparison to a day in Washington or Detroit or New Orleans, but it's still much more dangerous on the streets of Toronto than it was even 10 years ago. Why? Guns.

Regent Park has been redeveloped into a mixed-income neighbourhood now, with new condos and townhouses

http://www.torontolife.com/informer/tor ... ke-effect/

[Lemmy]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

Regent Park has been redeveloped into a mixed-income neighbourhood now, with new condos and townhouses.

BEING redeveloped, not "been". It's still mostly a shit hole.

[Zipperfish]

uwish uwish:

correct me if I am wrong

Yes, you are Nworng.

[Zipperfish]

Lemmy Lemmy:

BEING redeveloped, not "been". It's still mostly a shit hole.

You talking about Ontario? Yeah, I'd agree.

[BeaverFever]

Lemmy Lemmy:

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

Regent Park has been redeveloped into a mixed-income neighbourhood now, with new condos and townhouses.

BEING redeveloped, not "been". It's still mostly a shit hole.

The first of the new condos and townhouses, bank, grocery and a Tim Hortons opened up 5+ years ago already. They're almost finished with the final stages. The surrounding adjacent areas like Moss Park are slummy though.