[Zipperfish]

$1:

Drennan said when the officers entered the Safeway, they saw a man with a knife who was repeatedly stabbing himself.

"They started talking to him, issuing commands, directions to drop the knife," she said. "He refused to do so. He advanced on the officers and shots were fired."

If the guy is stabbing himself, what was the point of shooting him? To speed up the process?

[andyt]

Read the second part of the quote. Can't really blame the cops, you don't know if he's going to flip and come after them.

[Thanos]

A piece of bullshit considering your multiple thread cross-posting over the last week or so where you blame everything completely on the cops, including this morning when you insulted Stratos by implying that as a cop he probably behaved like he was in the SS.

[andyt]

Thanos Thanos:

A piece of bullshit .

Yes, yes it is.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

Well, with all the police activity of late, I just can't resist posting this song by Alice Cooper. Lyrics are below the video.




Leather boots poundin' the floor
Black and shiny kickin' the door
When the police hit the streets
They never take those boots off of their feet

If I break the law and get caught
I could get smashed in the face
By the big boys

'Cause they're frightened by the real world
Frightened by the real world
Scared of the real world, oh yeah

I saw a cop, he looked pretty shocked
By some criminals, left there to rot
I took a look, no one around
I put on his boots and stomped on the ground

Stood so tall and felt so strong
I wanted to be just like them
So I could hurt somebody
Hurt somebody

Hurt somebody, hurt somebody
Scared of the real world, oh yeah
Scared of the real world, oh yeah

Don't you litter or score in the dark
Don't kill your lover and don't over park
'Cause if you murder or if you loot
You'll get the heel of my new leather boots

If you break the law and get caught
You could get smashed in the face
By this young boy

Who is frightened by the real world
This boy is frightened by the real world
I'm gonna hurt somebody
'Cause I'm frightened of the real world

[Zipperfish]

andyt andyt:

Read the second part of the quote. Can't really blame the cops, you don't know if he's going to flip and come after them.

Yeah, I was being somewhat facetious. Still, they had to know that someone busy stabbing themselves isn't going to follow police instructions. Perhaps their instructions should have been "now drag the knife up your radial artery longitudinally..that's it..."

Sounds like the cops are guilty of shortening this guys life by about eight seconds.

[ShepherdsDog]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

$1:

Drennan said when the officers entered the Safeway, they saw a man with a knife who was repeatedly stabbing himself.

"They started talking to him, issuing commands, directions to drop the knife," she said. "He refused to do so. He advanced on the officers and shots were fired."

If the guy is stabbing himself, what was the point of shooting him? To speed up the process?

He'd already gone after one of the bakery clerks, and he was coming at the cops. Better it's just him rather than him and someone else.

[Unsound]

I don't think anyone is trying to argue that the shooting wasn't justified. What I'm getting from andy is that the the shooting needs to be investigated and questions like those Xort asked need to be asked. It's always possible to learn something that could be used in future similar situations. Whether it's a different way of dealing with the subject that doesn't lead to shooting, ir whether it's a matter of not emptying the magazine, or whatever.

[ShepherdsDog]

Doesn't sound like the Transit police were armed with tasers. More research has to go into non lethal means.

[Thanos]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Doesn't sound like the Transit police were armed with tasers. More research has to go into non lethal means.

Won't matter. Tazer, chokehold, baton, firearm, flashlight, or any other means of subduing a perp are all essentially irrelevant. Understanding that this has more to do with the grinding wheels of an active anti-police agenda as it does with keeping perps from dying is the important part. Give it another decade when the cops can shoot an expanding ball of taffy-like foam at the dirtbags that easily render the sons of bitches harmless and the shit disturbing motherfuckers will just come up with yet another new bitch/gripe/complaint and another bunch of lawsuits to lay on the police. This is all goddamn politics and nothing else.

[Unsound]

Did I miss the part where scores of people are clamoring for the cops involvrd to be lynched? Or whatever it is you're on about?

[ShepherdsDog]

Thanos Thanos:

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Doesn't sound like the Transit police were armed with tasers. More research has to go into non lethal means.

Won't matter. Tazer, chokehold, baton, firearm, flashlight, or any other means of subduing a perp are all essentially irrelevant. Understanding that this has more to do with the grinding wheels of an active anti-police agenda as it does with keeping perps from dying is the important part. Give it another decade when the cops can shoot an expanding ball of taffy-like foam at the dirtbags that easily render the sons of bitches harmless and the shit disturbing motherfuckers will just come up with yet another new bitch/gripe/complaint and another bunch of lawsuits to lay on the police. This is all goddamn politics and nothing else.

maybe you're right about the police withdrawing for a week. Then those suffering from andytinitis(formerly known as Fecal Reflux Disease) would sing a different tune.

[Xort]

stratos stratos:

When the same standards are used for criminals then this comment would make sense.

You don't think that protecting life is the highest priority of the police?

[stratos]

Xort Xort:

stratos stratos:

When the same standards are used for criminals then this comment would make sense.

You don't think that protecting life is the highest priority of the police?

Yes and that includes their own.

[Xort]

stratos stratos:

Yes and that includes their own.

If their are methods that will lower the chance of killing someone without raising the risk to the officers then those actions should be taken. They could be anything from more training to deal with the mentally ill, to safe shooting methods like only firing a single shot and assessing the danger potential of the person that has been shot. (A method that's gaining some support in the US with more responsible police forces)

This situation shouldn't be viewed as a close call with a dangerous man that put officer's life was at risk. But rather as a failure state when someone the police were to protect, ended up dead.

To flip it over, the legality for the use of lethal force by the police is the same as anyone else. It's only legal to protect a life or stop serious harm. If a ATC holder had drawn a pistol on this man, challenged him, then ended up killing the man in self defense I suspect most Canadians would be outraged. They would say he shouldn't have done that. This isn't the US. Let the police who are (in theory) trained to deal with these situations handle it.

And yet, dead is dead.

A fair question is, what would the UK police have done?