[ShepherdsDog]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

That white man's guilt you carry with you must be burdensome.

Nailed it.

Andy's goes on about white guilt until another ethnicity moves in next door or threatens his job at the coffee shop....then he goes NIMBY Nazi

[BartSimpson]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Andy's goes on about white guilt until another ethnicity moves in next door or threatens his job at the coffee shop....then he goes NIMBY Nazi

Andy reminds me of the lily-white liberal leftists in Davis, California.

They're all for halfway houses for felons, homeless shelters, low income housing, a higher minimum wage, and higher taxes...but not in their town.

In lily-white Liberal left Davis the homeless get run out of town and sent to Sacramento. There are no halfway houses. There's no low-income housing. And their minimum wage is at the legal minimum.

Andy would fit in just fine.

[andyt]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

andyt andyt:

Lot's of people already here long before any of these guys showed up. The diff is that when Columbus et al found the place they were representing a bunch of gold, fish and fur hungry bastards willing and able to kill, rape and pillage to get it and hold the territory, followed closely by people greedy for land and the ability to organize themselves how they saw fit. So "we saw it first" doesn't count for anything, and "we were here first' until recently didn't count for much more.

We can rationalize all we want, be we certainly are only here because our people before us were not very finicky about visiting depredations on the folks already here for millennia. Looks like it may all be coming back to bite us in the ass - sins of the fathers and all that.

Oh please, you make it sound like North America is the only place in the history of the world that was conquered by someone other than the original settlers.
And hell, at least the Natives fought back. Unlike today where it seems many Canadians, like you apparently, would be perfectly happy to roll over and let it happen to us because they'd rather flagellate themselves while wallowing in White guilt.

Do I. Point to the part of the quote where I say anything like that.

[andyt]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

andyt andyt:

Lot's of people already here long before any of these guys showed up. The diff is that when Columbus et al found the place they were representing a bunch of gold, fish and fur hungry bastards willing and able to kill, rape and pillage to get it and hold the territory, followed closely by people greedy for land and the ability to organize themselves how they saw fit. So "we saw it first" doesn't count for anything, and "we were here first' until recently didn't count for much more.

We can rationalize all we want, be we certainly are only here because our people before us were not very finicky about visiting depredations on the folks already here for millennia. Looks like it may all be coming back to bite us in the ass - sins of the fathers and all that.

What a load of tripe and trollop. There is no "we." Why on earth would I take personal responsibility for the actions of people centuries ago?

That white man's guilt you carry with you must be burdensome.

Really, no we, you have no connection to the past, aren't a descendant of somebody? Do you think you and your family would be living here now if our forebears hadn't practiced ethnic cleansing on a large scale in Canada? You'd be living in Europe somewhere, probably with a much lower standard of living.

[Jabberwalker]

The Solutreans made it here 20,000 years ago from peninsular Europe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis

[Public_Domain]

[fifeboy]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

The Solutreans made it here 20,000 years ago from peninsular Europe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solutrean_hypothesis

Yeah, and the Nazca lines were made to be landing strips for the Chariots of the Gods.

[ShepherdsDog]

Well then there's the genetic evidence carried by the Ojibwa. About 1/4 of them carry a strain mitochondrial DNA found in European populations, that has been dated to 17 000 years ago, and not some lonely French or British trapper/trader/missionary who arrived a couple centuries ago. The archaeological records also show Clovis technology radiating East to West, with it dying off altogether the closer you get to Alaska, where Natives entered North America. There are only bone and antler artifacts found on the other side of the Bering Strait. You'd think that it was a technology they developed, there'd be ample evidence and examples from the cultural hearth.

The natives don't want their myths about them being the only humans to have settled in the Americas being challenged. We're going to find that there were different waves at different times from different places. Look how touchy they are when it comes to Kennewick Man, who was possibly of Polynesian origin.

$1:

The remains, the tribe said, were those of a direct tribal ancestor. “From our oral histories, we know that our people have been part of this land since the beginning of time. We do not believe that our people migrated here from another continent, as the scientists do.”

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/k ... 62/?no-ist


Anyone who has been to New Zealand and other parts of Polynesia can't fail to notice that their canoes, totems, long houses and art are almost identical to what you find along the Pacific Northwest.

[fifeboy]

[url][/url]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Well then there's the genetic evidence carried by the Ojibwa. About 1/4 of them carry a strain mitochondrial DNA found in European populations, that has been dated to 17 000 years ago, and not some lonely French or British trapper/trader/missionary who arrived a couple centuries ago. The archaeological records also show Clovis technology radiating East to West, with it dying off altogether the closer you get to Alaska, where Natives entered North America. There are only bone and antler artifacts found on the other side of the Bering Strait. You'd think that it was a technology they developed, there'd be ample evidence and examples from the cultural hearth.

The natives don't want their myths about them being the only humans to have settled in the Americas being challenged. We're going to find that there were different waves at different times from different places. Look how touchy they are when it comes to Kennewick Man, who was possibly of Polynesian origin.

$1:

The remains, the tribe said, were those of a direct tribal ancestor. “From our oral histories, we know that our people have been part of this land since the beginning of time. We do not believe that our people migrated here from another continent, as the scientists do.”

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/k ... 62/?no-ist


Anyone who has been to New Zealand and other parts of Polynesia can't fail to notice that their canoes, totems, long houses and art are almost identical to what you find along the Pacific Northwest.

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v506/n7487/full/nature13025.html


And New Zealand? Don't you think that cultural similarities would occur more with closer Pacific cultures? Couldn't it be that similar materials available to people with similar (stone age) tools resulting in similar artifacts?

[Jabberwalker]

New Zealand is not any sort of ancient culture (on those islands, anyway). They were the last ones in Polynesia to be colonized by the Polynesians and they have only been there since our Middle Ages.

As an aside,
The Inuit in North America have only been there for about a thousand years, as well.

[fifeboy]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

New Zealand is not any sort of ancient culture (on those islands, anyway). They were the last ones in Polynesia to be colonized by the Polynesians and they have only been there since our Middle Ages.

As an aside,
The Inuit in North America have only been there for about a thousand years, as well.

New Zealand: what does that have to do with Pacific Coast Culture?

Inuit: indeed. Probably arrived shortly before the Norse. There is however an apparent direct line from Clovis to most modern Native Americans.

[DrCaleb]

fifeboy fifeboy:

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

New Zealand is not any sort of ancient culture (on those islands, anyway). They were the last ones in Polynesia to be colonized by the Polynesians and they have only been there since our Middle Ages.

As an aside,
The Inuit in North America have only been there for about a thousand years, as well.

New Zealand: what does that have to do with Pacific Coast Culture?

Inuit: indeed. Probably arrived shortly before the Norse. There is however an apparent direct line from Clovis to most modern Native Americans.

When the Thule (Innu) moved west to east from Siberia, there is evidence their iron tools were used to wipe out the Dorset people already living there, with whom the Vikings had been trading with for ~500 years.

There's a site on Baffin Island called 'Nanook' that used to be a trading post, and some rope and fabric is of Norse design and dates back more than 1000 years.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news ... utherland/

andyt andyt:

Really, no we, you have no connection to the past, aren't a descendant of somebody? Do you think you and your family would be living here now if our forebears hadn't practiced ethnic cleansing on a large scale in Canada? You'd be living in Europe somewhere, probably with a much lower standard of living.

If our fore bearers hadn't defeated or interbred with the Cro-Magnon then the Neanderthal, none of us would be here. We've gotten pretty good at ethnic cleansing. Just ask the Beothuk and Micmac.

. . . .oh, wait . . .

[ShepherdsDog]

The Beothuk were almost extinct by the time we showed up. They weren't the favorite neighbors of the other tribes. And, Cro Magnon were the first Homo sapiens sapiens in Europe. This culture ioriginated after the extinction and absorption of the Neanderthals.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

andyt andyt:

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

andyt andyt:

Lot's of people already here long before any of these guys showed up. The diff is that when Columbus et al found the place they were representing a bunch of gold, fish and fur hungry bastards willing and able to kill, rape and pillage to get it and hold the territory, followed closely by people greedy for land and the ability to organize themselves how they saw fit. So "we saw it first" doesn't count for anything, and "we were here first' until recently didn't count for much more.

We can rationalize all we want, be we certainly are only here because our people before us were not very finicky about visiting depredations on the folks already here for millennia. Looks like it may all be coming back to bite us in the ass - sins of the fathers and all that.

Oh please, you make it sound like North America is the only place in the history of the world that was conquered by someone other than the original settlers.
And hell, at least the Natives fought back. Unlike today where it seems many Canadians, like you apparently, would be perfectly happy to roll over and let it happen to us because they'd rather flagellate themselves while wallowing in White guilt.

Do I. Point to the part of the quote where I say anything like that.

There's no "part". Your entire post, among others, screams it.

[andyt]

You're right, there is no part. The screaming is coming from you.