[Jabberwalker]

andyt andyt:

We have less crime since the 70's. I would guess most criminals use the same amount of violence they did then. But the gangs have definitely gotten more violent. And that's what gets the attention and response from police.

Yes, but they don't have licence to declare martial law because of it.

[andyt]

We give it to them, until the point we no longer get a say. But all of us are willing to trade a degree of security for freedom. It's part of a civil society, the trick is getting it right.

[Jabberwalker]

andyt andyt:

We give it to them, until the point we no longer get a say. But all of us are willing to trade a degree of security for freedom. It's part of a civil society, the trick is getting it right.

... and getting it back after the horse has bolted from the barn. If you or I tried to start a movement to reduce the amount of serveillence being carried out on honest, private citizens, we would IMMEDIATELY be the subject of intense serveillence ... FOR SURE!