[Robair]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

And your friends are full of shit, in regards to your first post.

Could be. We'd had a bit of thanksgiving cheer by the time that conversation came up.

You, on the other hand, are a random dude on the internet.

[DrCaleb]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

You would be wrong, that it's not a natural response. Listen to the link - it's a radio interview with that same researcher. Very enlightening.

And why would an independent opinion from a U of A Biologist hurt the Oilpatches credibility?

I listened to it. I didn't find her argument all that convincing. I don't know the full story, but it sounds as if the birds were still alive after the storm, and had to put down due to oiling. If that's not the case, I stand corrected. If it is the case, then I maintain that death by oiling in a man-made toxic lake is not natural.

In that, you are correct. It was man made and not natural, but there are many measures in place to prevent wildlife from getting near the ponds. But she does have the full story, we don't. The commission hired her to find out if there was anything that could have been done, or can be done in the future to prevent these wildlife deaths.

The oil is extrememly toxic if injested, and sometimes the wildlife that injests it is beyond hope when found. I worked with the Edmonton Wildlife Rehabilitation Society when that Bunker Oil spilled into Lake Wabamun. It's sad, but it's life.

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

To answer your second question--that expert opinion informed the prosecutor's office, as I understand it. It sounds to me as if the detahs of a few hundred birds on the tailings is "a cost of doing business." That will be a hard sell, I think. It is to me, anyway.

Wildlife died from the toxins in those waters long before we came along. We just concentrated it for them. The oilsnads industry also spends a lot of money on things like floating cannons on the ponds to scare wildlife off. As the researcher concluded - birds follow rivers on their migratory route. They will land on the river by default, and anything near the river in an emergency. Having lit tailings ponds near the river is what contributed to the deaths. Since it's Alberta law that tailings ponds are to be recovered, hopefully this won't happen in the future.

[DrCaleb]

Robair Robair:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

And your friends are full of shit, in regards to your first post.

Could be. We'd had a bit of thanksgiving cheer by the time that conversation came up.

You, on the other hand, are a random dude on the internet.

I lived there for years. I might be random dude, but think about it - if it's so toxic as to kill nearby wildife through casual contact, do you really think it would be allowed to be in public in large open ponds? Does that really make sense?

[Thanos]

Syncrude got fined for the previous bird deaths that occurred that were entirely due to them fucking around with the noise system that was supposed to scare the ducks away. The second set of deaths was due to the weather conditions, which was obviously beyond Syncrude and Suncor's control. Seems reasonable to me that Syncrude be held liable (which they have been) for the wastage their deliberate actions caused, but clearly no one is guilty of things that happen as a result of the weather affecting animals.

Tailings pond up there are going to be a thing of the past within 20 years anyway. The new absorption/evaporation/recovery systems are going to cut the amount of time it takes to drain/remediate a tailings location by more than half. Add in the new concentration companies are putting into SAGD, where there are no tailings at all, and this entire area will be recovered and returned to nature in a much accelerated manner. Nothings perfect, of course, and there will always be future problems in any industry. But the companies are trying to make things better and less damaging overall to the local ecosystems. Anyone who says they aren't are just talking out of their Suzuki-propagandized asses as far as I'm concerned.

[Robair]

That all sounds good! Glad to hear it.






I'm still not moving there.

[Zipperfish]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Robair Robair:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

And your friends are full of shit, in regards to your first post.

Could be. We'd had a bit of thanksgiving cheer by the time that conversation came up.

You, on the other hand, are a random dude on the internet.

I lived there for years. I might be random dude, but think about it - if it's so toxic as to kill nearby wildife through casual contact, do you really think it would be allowed to be in public in large open ponds? Does that really make sense?

That's what I thought. For the birds to be oiled, there would have to be a separated hydrocarbon fraction sitting on top of the water (birds will not be acutely impacted by sheens). Wouldn't they skim any recoverable product off the top? Or are the the tailings impoundement areas just too big?

[DrCaleb]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Robair Robair:

Could be. We'd had a bit of thanksgiving cheer by the time that conversation came up.

You, on the other hand, are a random dude on the internet.

I lived there for years. I might be random dude, but think about it - if it's so toxic as to kill nearby wildife through casual contact, do you really think it would be allowed to be in public in large open ponds? Does that really make sense?

That's what I thought. For the birds to be oiled, there would have to be a separated hydrocarbon fraction sitting on top of the water (birds will not be acutely impacted by sheens). Wouldn't they skim any recoverable product off the top? Or are the the tailings impoundement areas just too big?

The ponds are quite large. Mildred Lake, Syncrude's first tailngs pond, has it's own postal code. But the sheen is mostly gone, only a little of it remains and it far less than the natural amount present in local water bodies.

They try to get the oil out, but it's mixed with ionized clay particles, so only time and the sun settles the old ponds. Newer facilities ar enot allowed tailings ponds, so they use a new process to reclaim the clay and oil.

1:

Mildred Lake.jpg [ 97.99 KiB | Viewed 76 times ]

Some of the ponds where the birds settled, (that will be reclaimed in the next 5 years).

0:

Tailings Ponds.jpg [ 118.09 KiB | Viewed 78 times ]