[OnTheIce]

andyt andyt:

Except the ministers have deputy ministers and others who are experts in their field. Otherwise basically any portfolio except attorney general wouldn't have a hope in hell of doing a good job.

Rarely the case, but it's nice to hope that sometimes it is.

[Lemmy]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

With respect to Drummond, it's not like the people at Queens Park, McGuinty, etc are experts in the respective fields of the portfolios they manage. In fact, the Education Minister is a lawyer with no education experience at all.

Which is why they should have talked to me. Teachers and their salaries aren't the problem. School boards, administrators and the College of Teachers are.

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

In terms of education, I think full-day kindergarten is an albatross that should have never started to begin with. It's a very expensive form of Provincial daycare.

I agree. I think full-day kindergarden is a horrible use of tax dollars. But my point was that most of Drummond's recommendations are based on accounting rather than actual changes to the system(s). If you want long-term, effective cost-saving changes, you have to actually investigate the system. Changes should be based on more than accounting. I think Drummond just grabbed the budget and a fine-point black Sharpie and started stroking until he hit his preconceived spending target.

[OnTheIce]

Lemmy Lemmy:

I agree. I think full-day kindergarden is a horrible use of tax dollars. But my point was that most of Drummond's recommendations are based on accounting rather than actual changes to the system(s). If you want long-term, effective cost-saving changes, you have to actually investigate the system. Changes should be based on more than accounting. I think Drummond just grabbed the budget and a fine-point black Sharpie and started stroking until he hit his preconceived spending target.

Respectfully disagree.

That report had Commission Members in the various fields, especially health and education and contained multiple recommendations in many cases.

McGuinty commissioned the report, got information he didn't want to hear and decided to ignore most of what was inside the report.

[Lemmy]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

That report had Commission Members in the various fields, especially health and education and contained multiple recommendations in many cases.

Who?

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

McGuinty commissioned the report, got information he didn't want to hear and decided to ignore most of what was inside the report.

He was right to ingore most of it. It's a pile of psudo-academic jibberish with no informed, constructive solutions. It looks like a term project that a group of undergraduate business students scrambled together in haste a week before a due-date. Lots of pretty graphs, not much else.

Here's the whole thing.

[OnTheIce]

Lemmy Lemmy:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

That report had Commission Members in the various fields, especially health and education and contained multiple recommendations in many cases.

Who?

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

McGuinty commissioned the report, got information he didn't want to hear and decided to ignore most of what was inside the report.

He was right to ingore most of it. It's a pile of psudo-academic jibberish with no informed, constructive solutions. It looks like a term project that a group of undergraduate business students scrambled together in haste a week before a due-date. Lots of pretty graphs, not much else.

Here's the whole thing.

You know who was involved, so why bother turning the question back with the link?

I notice you have a lack of respect for basically any economist or anyone's opinion on these types of issues (especially if they aren't on par with yours), despite their credentials or experience.

Why is that?

[Lemmy]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

You know who was involved, so why bother turning the question back with the link?

Because you claimed the commission had "members in the various fields, especially health and education". I was just wondering who those people were.

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

I notice you have a lack of respect for basically any economist or anyone's opinion on these types of issues (especially if they aren't on par with yours), despite their credentials or experience. Why is that?

What I lack respect for are people who pass themselves off as experts who aren't. I'll defer to Don Drummond on banking, not so much on public service economics. When it comes to the economics of public education in Ontario, Drummond's credentials aren't on par with mine. In general, economists rarely agree on much. That's part of our charm. "If you laid all the economists in the world end-to-end, they'd never a conclusion." - George Bernard Shaw

[CDN_PATRIOT]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

I'm unhappy that McGuinty is still fucking there.

I'll drink to that

-J.

[OnTheIce]

Lemmy Lemmy:

Because you claimed the commission had "members in the various fields, especially health and education". I was just wondering who those people were.

Cute. You see the people involved and their various experiences. It goes far beyond economics.

Lemmy Lemmy:

What I lack respect for are people who pass themselves off as experts who aren't. I'll defer to Don Drummond on banking, not so much on public service economics. When it comes to the economics of public education in Ontario, Drummond's credentials aren't on par with mine. In general, economists rarely agree on much. That's part of our charm. "If you laid all the economists in the world end-to-end, they'd never a conclusion." - George Bernard Shaw

You often pass yourself off as an expert in many topics, perhaps that's just a trait of being an economist?

[Lemmy]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Cute. You see the people involved and their various experiences. It goes far beyond economics.

Too bad it didn't go beyond economics and into education, per se, if that's the area to be cut.

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

You often pass yourself off as an expert in many topics, perhaps that's just a trait of being an economist?

Don't we all have more than one area of expertise? Fortunately you're always around to tell me what degree of fuck-all I know on any given subject.

[OnTheIce]

Lemmy Lemmy:

Too bad it didn't go beyond economics and into education, per se, if that's the area to be cut.

Besides the former deputy Minister of Education who served as a CFO for various school boards and who's a member of the Ontario College of Teachers?

Lemmy Lemmy:

Don't we all have more than one area of expertise?

According to you, no. Drummond is an economist after all, and that's all he's good at.

[Lemmy]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Besides the former deputy Minister of Education who served as a CFO for various school boards and who's a member of the Ontario College of Teachers.

That's a general conclusion my research has revealed: no one in The Ministry of Education, the College of Teachers (or the various school boards) has the first fucking clue about education.

[ShepherdsDog]

Most of their fucking consultants are useless tits too....the last time many of them were in a classroom was in university.