[DerbyX]

Its not about ability. Its about equality. Women aren't physically stronger yet they are equally important.

You seem to be taking thinking that the argument is that we are saying a rogers clerk and a infantry soldier have equal ability and chances storming a machine gun bunker.

Thats not the argument. Its that neither party is better then the other as a person or Canadian or contributor to society. I know plenty of people who wouldn't know which end of a rifle to hold yet they do jobs that would have hardened soldiers recoiling in disgust.

Some people are more physically and mentally suited to a combat role but thats simply not the issue.

[EyeBrock]

Who said one was better?
On the flip side let’s stop saying all people are equal because they most obviously are not.
Is that too hard a concept to take in?

[EyeBrock]

Mad_Bomber Mad_Bomber:

Ah but thats not saying the people aren’t equal, just their natural talents are. I know its semantics but I find its important to separate the person from what they do.

I have no problem rewarding the talented or gifted, its just punishing the untalented that I have a problem with. If someone cant make it in the military thats alright, I just wont think less of them for it.

Me niether. Not everybody can do the job, just like everybody can't be an American Idol or a Bay Street wanker who drives a porsche and get's 2% MER on my RSSP's.

If I could drive that porsche do you think I'd do the job I'm doing now? I'm just not that wankery or clever.

Should you look down at me? Depends if you are a bond trader or not!

[DerbyX]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

Who said one was better?
On the flip side let’s stop saying all people are equal because they most obviously are not.
Is that too hard a concept to take in?

Thats because you aren't looking at equal in the proper light. Its not a description of capability.

Lets try a different tact. The infantry are doing all the fighting and dying so are they making more of a sacrifice (and hence elevated) then the navy?

Back in the days of GFPB (when he wasn't passing himself off as stuntmanmike) he made some rather unsavory comments that the support trades deserved less respect then the combat trades and that wasn't received well by other CF folk yet its essentially the same argument.

Soldiers with special forces training will be better suited and able for combat then say a cook. Are they less important in the military? Are they less a soldier?

He made that argument and I find this to be an extension of that argument.

People are equal under the law is a decent analogy. You would say that everybody is equal under your god. That seems a prevailing theme in christianity and thats the argument we are putting forth.

Even among combat soldiers there is a degree of capability yet somehow thats not the question is it?

[novachick]

lily lily:

Really? Tell me then, nova.... who said it? Who claimed that non-military people love their kids more than those who serve?

Well then perhaps you will explain clearly for us what exactly your point was?

[novachick]

lily lily:

lily lily:

Some of us don't want to leave our children in order to pursue a career.

Canadian Forces Personal don't ever want to leave their children either. It is heart crushing to see their faces when they do. It is just one of the many huge sacrifices they make in the name of this country. That is why I say it is so much more than just a career.

[TattoodGirl]

Yes it is a tough gig, but it is a choice to go into that field. But no one should ever put someone on a higher pedestal than others because of the nature of their profession. We all do what we are good at and hopefully love what we do and most make sacrifices to make the lives we live....thus contributing on an equal level to what Canada is.

[novachick]

TattoodGirl TattoodGirl:

Yes it is a tough gig, but it is a choice to go into that field. But no one should ever put someone on a higher pedestal than others because of the nature of their profession. We all do what we are good at and hopefully love what we do and most make sacrifices to make the lives we live....thus contributing on an equal level to what Canada is.

Do I put them on a pedestal....no. Do I have a much deeper respect for Canadian forces personal than the lawyer, retail clerk etc. absolutely. I don't apologize for that. Their sacrifices are to numerous to mention and they are not for their personal gain. All they gain for them are hellish nightmares , we compensate them for their action the only way we can monetarily but it isn't nearly enough or as much as you think. I have a deep respect that they have the inner fortitude to make that choice because I for one do not.

[novachick]

lily lily:

Yes.... but it's a choice they made. Everyone makes their own choices, based on what they feel is best for them. It doesn't make any one of us better - or worse - than another.

Unless the choice is to be a gangbanger.

See my post to Tatt.

[novachick]

lily lily:

novachick novachick:

lily lily:

Yes.... but it's a choice they made. Everyone makes their own choices, based on what they feel is best for them. It doesn't make any one of us better - or worse - than another.

Unless the choice is to be a gangbanger.

See my post to Tatt.

Yes, I read that. However, I was responding to you with regard to Shep's post. I hope you can see I never said what he claimed I said.

Yes I understand the point you were getting at now. I am happy you wouldn't think something that dark and ugly.

[TattoodGirl]

novachick novachick:

TattoodGirl TattoodGirl:

Yes it is a tough gig, but it is a choice to go into that field. But no one should ever put someone on a higher pedestal than others because of the nature of their profession. We all do what we are good at and hopefully love what we do and most make sacrifices to make the lives we live....thus contributing on an equal level to what Canada is.

Do I put them on a pedestal....no. Do I have a much deeper respect for Canadian forces personal than the lawyer, retail clerk etc. absolutely. I don't apologize for that. Their sacrifices are to numerous to mention and they are not for their personal gain. All they gain for them are hellish nightmares , we compensate them for their action the only way we can monetarily but it isn't nearly enough or as much as you think. I have a deep respect that they have the inner fortitude to make that choice because I for one do not.

Didnt say I didnt have respect for them, but I have a deep respect for just about everyone. We all choose paths we are destined for, well at least I hope people do. And having more respect for someones career based on percieved sacrifice than someone else is putting on a pedestal.

[ShepherdsDog]

Well, someone needs to learn how to become a more effective communicator because I wasn't the only person who read that comment that same way.

[novachick]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Well, someone needs to learn how to become a more effective communicator because I wasn't the only person who read that comment that same way.

I agree Shep I read it the same way also.

[novachick]

TattoodGirl TattoodGirl:

novachick novachick:

TattoodGirl TattoodGirl:

Yes it is a tough gig, but it is a choice to go into that field. But no one should ever put someone on a higher pedestal than others because of the nature of their profession. We all do what we are good at and hopefully love what we do and most make sacrifices to make the lives we live....thus contributing on an equal level to what Canada is.

Do I put them on a pedestal....no. Do I have a much deeper respect for Canadian forces personal than the lawyer, retail clerk etc. absolutely. I don't apologize for that. Their sacrifices are to numerous to mention and they are not for their personal gain. All they gain for them are hellish nightmares , we compensate them for their action the only way we can monetarily but it isn't nearly enough or as much as you think. I have a deep respect that they have the inner fortitude to make that choice because I for one do not.

Didnt say I didnt have respect for them, but I have a deep respect for just about everyone. We all choose paths we are destined for, well at least I hope people do. And having more respect for someones career based on percieved sacrifice than someone else is putting on a pedestal.

I may be reading the last of your post incorrectly. The sacrifice is not perceived for me, I've seen it up close and personal and it completely shredded my heart and mind. Made it's just a world you have to walk in to truly understand it.

[novachick]

lily lily:

novachick novachick:

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Well, someone needs to learn how to become a more effective communicator because I wasn't the only person who read that comment that same way.

I agree Shep I read it the same way also.

Really? Seems to me you simply read Shep's comment and made assumptions. My "explanation" was merely a quote of my earlier statement.

Shep - you were the only one who commented... so I take it the supposed others PMed you?

No what I read gave me a pain you can't understand and I was choosing not to respond to it.