[Newsbot]

Title: Ontario taxpayers subsidized buyers of $1.1 million Porsche 918 Spyder
Category: Provincial Politics
Posted By: shockedcanadian
Date: 2016-04-26 09:29:07
Canadian

[andyt]

150k seems like a good limit for the subsidies. And make the subsidy a specific amount, ie you get the same amount of cash back no matter which car you buy.

[shockedcanadian]

See those people in the background with pom poms in their hands? Those people are called the OPP.

[peck420]

andyt andyt:

150k seems like a good limit for the subsidies. And make the subsidy a specific amount, ie you get the same amount of cash back no matter which car you buy.

$150k?

You have got to be joking. The cap should be way under that with a larger subsidy per vehicle.

The point of the subsidy is to get lots of consumers bums in electric vehicles. Your average consumer is not shopping above $100,000, for a vehicle. Heck, the average isn't even coming close to that.

Just my personal opinion, any who.

[shockedcanadian]

And the response. Wynne has been under a lot of heat lately:

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canad ... 00-rebates

[DrCaleb]

peck420 peck420:

andyt andyt:

150k seems like a good limit for the subsidies. And make the subsidy a specific amount, ie you get the same amount of cash back no matter which car you buy.

$150k?

You have got to be joking. The cap should be way under that with a larger subsidy per vehicle.

The point of the subsidy is to get lots of consumers bums in electric vehicles. Your average consumer is not shopping above $100,000, for a vehicle. Heck, the average isn't even coming close to that.

Just my personal opinion, any who.

$150k however keeps it so that any mass production EV is covered, from the Chev Volt to the Fisker Karma and Tesla X and S models. It would exclude the Porsche 918 and McLaren P1.

[peck420]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

$150k however keeps it so that any mass production EV is covered, from the Chev Volt to the Fisker Karma and Tesla X and S models. It would exclude the Porsche 918 and McLaren P1.

So what?

The subsidy is supposed to modify consumer habits, not act as marketing material for manufacturers.

A larger subsidy on more economical models would do far more to change consumer habits. A subsidy that includes the likes of Fiskar and Tesla, is nothing more that government subsidized marketing.

If you can afford a Tesla S...you gonna balk at $5,000? I sure as hell ain't.

[DrCaleb]

peck420 peck420:

A larger subsidy on more economical models would do far more to change consumer habits. A subsidy that includes the likes of Fiskar and Tesla, is nothing more that government subsidized marketing.

It all depends on the focus of the subsidies. If it's just to spur market adoption, then a flat rate for a pure electric is in order. All of them, equally.

If you want to create higher 'fleet' efficiency by getting less efficient cars off the road, then why wouldn't you want to subsidize two of the only 'family' focused 4 door pure electric cars, like the Teslas? If you subsidize the BMW i8 and the Chevy Volt, then how could you not subsidize the Fiskar which would be right in between them price wise?

If you simply don't want to subsidize multi million dollar hypercars, then you have to set a price ceiling for the subsidies.

[shockedcanadian]

I recall the multi-million dollar "subsidy" to MLSE when they hosted the NBA all-star game a coupel fo years back. I emailed Crooked Wynne abou the use of tax dollars to fund the wealthiest sports ownership group in Canada.

When you have the security apparatus protecting their own, of which she is an honourary member; the theft of tax dollars with flimsy arguments for any cosmetic reason is fair game.

No wonder our allies don't trust us...

[peck420]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

It all depends on the focus of the subsidies. If it's just to spur market adoption, then a flat rate for a pure electric is in order. All of them, equally.

That is incorrect.

If the only intent of the subsidy was to modify market adoption rates, we would have never heard of it. It would have been entirely on the supply side. Far easier to modify market adoption when you can modify supplier offerings.

But, that kind of subsidy is not the best for publicity...always a factor with this.

$1:

If you simply don't want to subsidize multi million dollar hypercars, then you have to set a price ceiling for the subsidies.

Which is what I endorse.

I don't think reducing the cap is enough. I think the cap should be reduced a lot (to the $60,000 range), coupled with an increase in subsidy based on consumer income.

That targets the single largest market, at current, the middle class, with an added bonus for the less fortunate.

[DrCaleb]

peck420 peck420:

I don't think reducing the cap is enough. I think the cap should be reduced a lot (to the $60,000 range), coupled with an increase in subsidy based on consumer income.

That targets the single largest market, at current, the middle class, with an added bonus for the less fortunate.

And that's why I like $150k. It still subsidies the EVs that would appeal to people driving the gas guzzlers, minivans and small SUVs. It would get more of them off the road that subsidizing the smaller vehicles like the Tesla Roadster or Chev Volt. And if I'm not mistaken, a $60k ceiling would only subsidize the Volt. Most everything is more expensive, or starting in the $60k range.

[peck420]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

And if I'm not mistaken, a $60k ceiling would only subsidize the Volt. Most everything is more expensive, or starting in the $60k range.

The Volt and the Model 3.

The only two that are inside the average consumers price range.

Granted, this subsidy was enacted prior to the 3, so, yup...the Volt.

Ironically, the one that should be getting the most consumer recognition...until the 3 hits the road in numbers, anyway.

[DrCaleb]

peck420 peck420:

Ironically, the one that should be getting the most consumer recognition...until the 3 hits the road in numbers, anyway.

Au contraire mon ami! The Tesla Roadster is lighter, and has a longer range (on battery only) And it's very pretty.

But they are hard to find.

[Delwin]

Subsidies work the same on large ticket items as they do on low priced items. People will sometimes purchase based on a greater percieved value. If subsidizing more expensive vehicles get more people into electric cars then i am all for it. It will encourage more manufacturors to look in that direction and promotes innovation in the field. It doesnt matter that I cant afford to take advantage of the subsidy. It encourages production of the technology on a larger scale which means that eventually costs will come down and i should be able to take advantage someday.

[Lemmy]

So let's summarize:

1. Gov't introduced subsidy to encourage people to buy electric cars.

2. A handful of rich douchehammers filed claims on expensive electric cars and were reimbursed under this program.

3. Ontario premier announces that the subsidy will be re-written to exempt luxury electric vehicles from the program, stating that that hadn't been anticipated when the program was launched.

So what's the issue here then?