[Newsbot]

Title: James Forcillo guilty of attempted murder in streetcar shooting of Sammy Yatim
Category: Law & Order
Posted By: shockedcanadian
Date: 2016-01-25 10:01:25
Canadian

[BeaverFever]

Link is broken but basically jurors ultimately found that Forcillo was justified in firing his first 3-round volley, which felled and ultimately killed Yatim, but was guilty of Attempted Murder for the subsequent 6-round volley he fired at Yatim after he was on the ground.

IMO, the cop got off easy, but I guess it's as close to justice as one can reasonably get when it comes to police shootings.

[uwish]

I would agree, he is still going to spend considerable time behind bars..

[shockedcanadian]

As long as he is never a cop again, never carries a gun again. This is a great decision for the citizens of Toronto AND the TPS.

Here is the deal. He will appeal, the appeal will take many years, he will get paid during the appeal the taxpayer will pay for his expensive appeal. Even bad cops cannot be rid of easily or cheaply, even the bad apples who take peoples lives. This, if the appeal doesn't clear him. Listen to Mike McCormick, a delusional man who cares little about the reputation of his force, he just cares to defend at all costs.

What did this guy do to get hired? Someone with his judgement, psychological and emotional makeup is allowed to carry a gun? Sorry, they need to better screen so that such people do not destroy the reputation of those who aren't unfit as this officer clearly has shown.

[martin14]

$1:

A jury has found Toronto police Const. James Forcillo guilty of attempted murder in the 2013 shooting death of Sammy Yatim, but not guilty of second-degree murder.

Forcillo faced two charges related to the shooting death of 18-year-old Yatim on a streetcar in 2013.

The jury believed Forcillo was justified in firing the first three shots at Yatim. This is reflected in the not guilty verdict for second-degree murder. The jury found Forcillo was not justified in the second round of shots at Yatim, hence guilty of attempted murder.

Jurors reached the verdicts Monday after six days of deliberations.

Forcillo, 32, had pleaded not guilty to both charges at the start of his trial which began in Toronto on Oct. 20.

Guilty of attempted murder ?

How the hell can you be guilty of attempted murder when the vic is dead ?

Sorry, that makes no sense.

So basically the jury said the first 3 shots were fine, but not the next 6.

$1:

The jury believed Forcillo was justified in firing the first three shots at Yatim. This is reflected in the not guilty verdict for second-degree murder. The jury found Forcillo was not justified in the second round of shots at Yatim, hence guilty of attempted murder.

Guilty for shooting at a dead guy is attempted murder ?

This one's not done yet, not by a long shot.

[ShepherdsDog]

It is more than a little confusing. They acknowledge the fact that the first 3 shots were justified and that they killed Yatim. How do you attempt to kill someone who is already dead as a result of a justified shooting?

[BeaverFever]

martin14 martin14:

Guilty of attempted murder ?

How the hell can you be guilty of attempted murder when the vic is dead ?

Sorry, that makes no sense.

So basically the jury said the first 3 shots were fine, but not the next 6.

$1:

The jury believed Forcillo was justified in firing the first three shots at Yatim. This is reflected in the not guilty verdict for second-degree murder. The jury found Forcillo was not justified in the second round of shots at Yatim, hence guilty of attempted murder.

Guilty for shooting at a dead guy is attempted murder ?

This one's not done yet, not by a long shot.

First off, he was likely dying, but not dead at the time of the second volley. Second, and probably more importantly, the charge is about the cop's motive when he fired the second set of shots - the cop thought Yatim was still alive. He didn't say "hey guys watch me plug the corpse of this guy who's already dead". He thought Yatim was still alive and shot 6 more times unnecessarily (missing once). The allegation is that he fired those 6 extra shots with the intent of murdering him.

[DrCaleb]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

How do you attempt to kill someone who is already dead as a result of a justified shooting?

Like always, intent is everything. I'd assume the jury divided the shooting into two parts, the first three shots, and the rest of the clip.

The first three could be seen as self defense. The rest of them, the suspect was of no immediate threat, but the officer kept shooting to be sure the suspect was indeed dead. That changes intention from self defence to attempted murder.

[BeaverFever]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

How do you attempt to kill someone who is already dead as a result of a justified shooting?

Like always, intent is everything. I'd assume the jury divided the shooting into two parts, the first three shots, and the rest of the clip.

The first three could be seen as self defense. The rest of them, the suspect was of no immediate threat, but the officer kept shooting to be sure the suspect was indeed dead. That changes intention from self defence to attempted murder.

It was the crown who divided up the charges from the outset. He was charged with 2nd Degree Murder for the first 3-shot volley, and separately the Crown charged him Attempted Murder for the second six-shot volley, which came almost 6 seconds later while Yatim was on the ground.

[martin14]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

First off, he was likely dying, but not dead at the time of the second volley. Second, and probably more importantly, the charge is about the cop's motive when he fired the second set of shots - the cop thought Yatim was still alive. He didn't say "hey guys watch me plug the corpse of this guy who's already dead". He thought Yatim was still alive and shot 6 more times unnecessarily (missing once). The allegation is that he fired those 6 extra shots with the intent of murdering him.

So, if he was still alive after three, then the next 6 should be the murder.

See ?

No sense.

[Thanos]

Always a shame to see a good cop get railroaded like this.

[shockedcanadian]

Yeah, outside of him being in the very top % of police who have pulled their guns over 4 times (a link I posted last week), whispers in the news that there were certain qualities about his character that were being suppressed by the TPS, and, the fact that he was the only one to fire his gun out of 25 officers, thus debunking the "training is the problem" argument, he is the salt of the earth...

Every agency had bad apples. The RCMP and OPP will continue to feel criticism along with the TPS. Until we deal with these abuses that threaten our way of life and global competitiveness, we will continue to lose our reputations and opportunities. Unlike 1976, we have cameras everywhere, ways to share this media through the media sources on the internet. Society is no longer beholden to learning about details from traditional media sources alone.

It's a great time to be a good cop, a really poor time to be an officer not worthy of being called an officer.

[ShepherdsDog]

$1:

So, if he was still alive after three, then the next 6 should be the murder.

If he was alive after the first three, he still posed a possible threat and the next six were justifiable. can they prove which round was the fatal one?

[BartSimpson]

Thanos Thanos:

Always a shame to see a good cop get railroaded like this.

This guy was not a good cop. He fired on someone who was not an immediate threat and then he continued to fire after the person was disabled.

If he was a soldier and the shoot took place in Kabul instead of Toronto his ass would be in the stockade for the rest of his life.

Pretty sad when the ROE for terrorists are more restrictive than for your own people.

[Lemmy]

What a ridiculous outcome, stretching logic to absurdity. How can someone possibly be guilty of attempted murder but not guilty of murder when the guy ended up dead? Yeah, I get the "two incidents" argument, but I'm not buying it.

Bring on the appellate process. This one'll be a decade straightening out. And "suspended with pay", eh?