[Newsbot]

Title: Defying party, Tulsi Gabbard votes 'present' on Trump impeachment | CTV News
Category: Political
Posted By: uwish
Date: 2019-12-19 09:53:40

[uwish]

I really like Tulsi, if I was an 'merican I would want her name of the democrat ticket for prez. I have listened to her speak on JRE et al. She has great ideas and is a very effective communicator.

[stratos]

$1:

She has great ideas and is a very effective communicator.

You just made the case why the Dem's wont back her.

[uwish]

you are probably correct..

[N_Fiddledog]

This current version of a Progressive Socialist Democrat Party is self-destructive.

Tulsi Gabbard is more classic Liberal. She doesn't fit in with the rest of them.

[stratos]

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

This current version of a Progressive Socialist Democrat Party is self-destructive.

Tulsi Gabbard is more classic Liberal. She doesn't fit in with the rest of them.

That is why I am at least willing to listen to her ideas. Might not agree with them but I will hear her out.

[Tricks]

stratos stratos:

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

This current version of a Progressive Socialist Democrat Party is self-destructive.

Tulsi Gabbard is more classic Liberal. She doesn't fit in with the rest of them.

That is why I am at least willing to listen to her ideas. Might not agree with them but I will hear her out.

You both might want to actually listen to her ideas then. She's one of the most Socialist and progressive candidates running.

That's why the Democrats don't like her. Because they want someone like Biden, who fails a lot of those checks. As did Hilary.

One day you guys will wake up and realise that the old guard of the democrats aren't socialist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political ... candidates

[stratos]

Tricks Tricks:

stratos stratos:

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

This current version of a Progressive Socialist Democrat Party is self-destructive.

Tulsi Gabbard is more classic Liberal. She doesn't fit in with the rest of them.

That is why I am at least willing to listen to her ideas. Might not agree with them but I will hear her out.

You both might want to actually listen to her ideas then. She's one of the most Socialist and progressive candidates running.

That's why the Democrats don't like her. Because they want someone like Biden, who fails a lot of those checks. As did Hilary.

One day you guys will wake up and realise that the old guard of the democrats aren't socialist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political ... candidates

So you shouldn't listen to someone who speaks and act like an adult. We should only listen to someone who sounds like a nut case and speaks down to and belittles people. As I said I would listen but probably wouldn't agree with her.

[N_Fiddledog]

It depends on whether you're defining the two groups by the sort of definition you might find someplace like Wikipedia or by the way they represent themselves.

I think Sargon has the easiest way of separating the two. Liberals believe in equality of opportunity - that all should start from a point where they each have equal opportunity to succeed. Controls after that are only to see that this equality of opportunity proceeds without impediment. Progressives believe in equality of outcome - that the priority is that all arrive in equal slots and how they get there is by the management and superior virtue of the Progressive overlords.

He argues the nit pickery of this with Joe Rogan:

[Tricks]

stratos stratos:

So you shouldn't listen to someone who speaks and act like an adult. We should only listen to someone who sounds like a nut case and speaks down to and belittles people. As I said I would listen but probably wouldn't agree with her.

You literally just said you might want to actually listen to her because she's a classic Liberal and not a "progressive socialist". Unless you missed a few sentences in your last post.

[N_Fiddledog]

Well he was agreeing with me so I'll explain to you why he's correct.

What I'm calling Progressive Socialism is about incrementally but ultimately obtaining the power to influence the outcome and create this state of equality they tell you they see. Really it's more just about by hook or by crook obtaining the power.

So yes, that creates the nuttery and unwarranted posturing of imagined, superior virtue in things like cancel culture or impeach a president who hasn't broken any laws, or safe spaces or 'anybody who disagrees is a fascist so let's attack some garbage cans' and so on...

[N_Fiddledog]

Wait I think I can explain this to you better if we pull one from her platform.

Tulsi Gabbard on Islam/Fighting Islamophobia

Liberals are easily duped. So she believes in this imaginary thing the Muslim Brotherhood created and called "Islamophobia."

Progressives also see this horror they call Islamophobia but they are more concerned with how to use objection to it to degrade the traditional fabric of western society and transfer the power to themselves.

But they'll both agree there is something called Islamophobia and it's bad.

Tulsi's solution seems to be simply to support and respect Islam's right to freedom of religion and not allow inequity in its treatment.

A progressive wants to go EU and one day illegalize anything it wants to call hate. If freedom of speech gets in the way then there should be no freedom of speech or at least you should get into the habit of only being free to speak what they want you to speak.

[bootlegga]

stratos stratos:

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

This current version of a Progressive Socialist Democrat Party is self-destructive.

Tulsi Gabbard is more classic Liberal. She doesn't fit in with the rest of them.

That is why I am at least willing to listen to her ideas. Might not agree with them but I will hear her out.

As Tricks noted, she is not a 'Classic liberal' - Gabbard endorsed Sanders in 2016...and her platform is sqaurely onside with most other Democrats (green economy, universal healthcare, environmental protection, pro-choice, etc.).

https://www.tulsi2020.com/issues

FWIW, I've long thought she would be a great President (smart, veteran, woman, visible minority, etc), but that's exactly why she won't win the Democratic ticket - too many Dems want someone farther left than her. And her acts of rebellion (like this vote) have not endeared her to the old gaurd either.

[N_Fiddledog]

bootlegga bootlegga:

stratos stratos:

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

This current version of a Progressive Socialist Democrat Party is self-destructive.

Tulsi Gabbard is more classic Liberal. She doesn't fit in with the rest of them.

That is why I am at least willing to listen to her ideas. Might not agree with them but I will hear her out.

As Tricks noted, she is not a 'Classic liberal' - Gabbard endorsed Sanders in 2016...and her platform is sqaurely onside with most other Democrats (green economy, universal healthcare, environmental protection, pro-choice, etc.).

And as I responded one can observe how equality of opportunity versus equality of outcome establishes the line between liberal and progressive.

Many Liberals are on board in some form or another with policy platforms such as you posted above. I gave you an example of one policy platform from her website and showed you how Progressives and Liberals can both agree in the general and disagree on specifics on a policy.

And this one from the Liberal Values blog might interest you:

Why Millennials, And Older Liberals, Support Sanders Over Clinton

However one might say Tulsi is liberal about progressives. You know who else she gets along with Tucker Carlson.

[N_Fiddledog]

Wanna see something that can fascinate an open mind?

Here's a Conservative (Lauren Chen) going over Progressives (The Young Turks) critiquing a Liberal (Dave Reuben) interviewing Tulsi Gabbard.



The Young Turk progressives seem to agree with me. They don't seem to think Gabbard is a real Progressive.

Liberal Dave Reuben seems to like her though.