[Newsbot]

Title: China Sends Fighters To East China Sea
Category: Military
Posted By: Scape
Date: 2013-01-11 22:09:19

[Canadian_Mind]

Oh that's cool...

Why has the west been building closer ties with China? Especially since Tiananmen Square? Clealy not good guys here. Seems erily remnicient of the buildup to WWII.

[Scape]

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/01/10 ... -us-japan/

[saturn_656]

If China takes the Senkaku Islands and the Americans fail to assist as their defence treaty with Japan stipulates, it will be open season on anyone who sits on territory claimed by Beijing. There would be no one else to keep them in check.

[martin14]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

If China takes the Senkaku Islands and the Americans fail to assist as their defence treaty with Japan stipulates, it will be open season on anyone who sits on territory claimed by Beijing.

Or by anyone else for that matter.

Oh and that would include our North, let's not forget the Chinese
have tried to say 25% of it should be theirs.

Let's hope it doesn't get that far.

[saturn_656]

martin14 martin14:

saturn_656 saturn_656:

If China takes the Senkaku Islands and the Americans fail to assist as their defence treaty with Japan stipulates, it will be open season on anyone who sits on territory claimed by Beijing.

Or by anyone else for that matter.

Oh and that would include our North, let's not forget the Chinese
have tried to say 25% of it should be theirs.

Let's hope it doesn't get that far.

If the Americans stiff Japan (hell even if they don't), we shouldn't assume they'd come flying in guns blazing to assist us. It's why having a military capable of single handedly defeating a military expedition from a country such as China is so important. In the future that will mean a beefier Navy and Air Force.

[Canadian_Mind]

I'm concerned about the implications outside of East Asia? What about in Africa or South America where territorial claims and resources currently claimed or controlled regional powers (The Falklands as an example) get the backing of China? Where would Britain stand if China backs the Argies if the US didn't step up to save Japan? Where would South Africa stand against the rest of Africa if it had Chinese backing? Where would the Aussies stand if Malaysia, The Philippines, and Vietnam had Chinese backing? And as mentioned, where would we stand if the American's stood by as Chinese Icebreakers and submarines began traversing through their half of the Bering Strait in order to lay claim to our waters and islands? Hell, what if they are so bold as to outright take Siberia from Russia? It might seem far-fetched now, but the implications of the dispute over this little island could greatly and adversely affect the way the world looks in 5-10 years.

[Scape]

[Regina]

Hope their fighters don't have fake parts from.............North America.

[herbie]

Oh Jesus how can you seriously discuss "long term larger threats" when you think China has half of the Bering Straight?
China's just now becoming of naval significance in their own area, they can't do shit to the Falklands (another ocean FFS!) or even get to the Arctic unless Russia and the USA let them.
Of course we have to boost our presence on the West Coast and Arctic, but warning about invasions by the bogeyman is for US consumption. Most Canucks can read a map.

[Canadian_Mind]

herbie herbie:

Oh Jesus how can you seriously discuss "long term larger threats" when you think China has half of the Bering Straight?
China's just now becoming of naval significance in their own area, they can't do shit to the Falklands (another ocean FFS!) or even get to the Arctic unless Russia and the USA let them.
Of course we have to boost our presence on the West Coast and Arctic, but warning about invasions by the bogeyman is for US consumption. Most Canucks can read a map.

Take your blinders off. Just because they can't do it now doesn't mean they wont in the future. If China can push American allies around in their own back yard, of course they will have aspirations to push more and more in the future. They'll keep pushing until the USA finally decides to push back. That's the definition of a power struggle. How far will America allow China to push before they push back. If America is willing to push back now, China may never have the nuts to challenge the USA again, at least not for a significant period of time.

China wont need to do shit to the Falklands, they just have to back Argentina with enough money and equipment for them to do it on their own, much as Germany did for Nationalist Spain in 1936, the Soviets for Vietnam in the 50s through to the 70s, and America for Afghanistan in the 1980s.

[saturn_656]

$1:

China wont need to do shit to the Falklands, they just have to back Argentina with enough money and equipment for them to do it on their own

You know what? I can see the wicked witch of the south actually making such a deal, no matter the cost. Who knows, China's price might not even be that steep. I'm sure they wouldn't mind seeing the UK humbled.

[BartSimpson]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

If the Americans stiff Japan (hell even if they don't), we shouldn't assume they'd come flying in guns blazing to assist us. It's why having a military capable of single handedly defeating a military expedition from a country such as China is so important. In the future that will mean a beefier Navy and Air Force.

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bootlegga]

martin14 martin14:

Or by anyone else for that matter.

Oh and that would include our North, let's not forget the Chinese
have tried to say 25% of it should be theirs.

Let's hope it doesn't get that far.

He actually said 20% of the Arctic, not just 20% of the Canadian Arctic.

$1:

A Chinese admiral said in early 2010 that since China has 20 percent of the world’s population, it should have 20 percent of the Arctic’s resources.

http://northshorejournal.org/the-chines ... the-arctic

saturn_656 saturn_656:

If the Americans stiff Japan (hell even if they don't), we shouldn't assume they'd come flying in guns blazing to assist us. It's why having a military capable of single handedly defeating a military expedition from a country such as China is so important. In the future that will mean a beefier Navy and Air Force.

I'd hope so - but given Canadians general lack of interest in the military unless there is a shooting war going on, I'm doubtful any government of ours will ever build a strong enough navy and/or air force to keep them at bay - should they decide they are interested in any of our land.

If we were serious about Arctic defence, we would be building the three heavy armed icebreakers Harper promised in 2006 as well as subs capable of under ice ops, not building just one heavy (unarmed) icebreaker and 6 AOPVs.

I have little doubt that if the Liberals form the next government, we won't even get those.

[saturn_656]

bootlegga bootlegga:

If we were serious about Arctic defence, we would be building the three heavy armed icebreakers Harper promised in 2006 as well as subs capable of under ice ops, not building just one heavy (unarmed) icebreaker and 6 AOPVs.

If we were serious about Arctic defence we'd be buying SSN's. I'm no naval captain, but pretty well everything I've read on the topic suggests icebreakers are good for basic patrol and research duties but if bullets fly they are not of much (any) use. ASW in Arctic ice is near impossible. In theory armed icebreakers would be able to combat other armed icebreakers, but AFAIK no one else has built any. The ice will keep other countries conventional warships out of the region same as ours.

UAV/UCAV's should be able to cover anything on top of the water. SSN's for whatever may be under it.