[Newsbot]

Title: $117-million later, Ottawa's troubles with Sikorsky aren't over
Category: Military
Posted By: Hyack
Date: 2009-01-07 10:43:09
Canadian

[roger-roger]

What a shit show.

[DerbyX]

Isn't this breech of contract and grounds for us to sue them?

$1:

According to the 2004 contract, DND was supposed to receive the first fully equipped helicopter in 2008.

[BartSimpson]

DerbyX DerbyX:

Isn't this breech of contract and grounds for us to sue them?

$1:

According to the 2004 contract, DND was supposed to receive the first fully equipped helicopter in 2008.

It would be a breech if Sikorsky failed to deliver the helicopters as they were originally specified. But the deal is in arbitration because as Sikorsky was working on the helicopters the specs the DND wanted kept changing. In any contract when the specs change the due dates go right on out the window.

I don't build helicopters, but I've done plenty of network installs where I give a due date and then someone starts adding to our work orders and I end up over-due and over-budget and it's pretty universal that the clients alwasy think they can make radical changes to their contract and not have it affect the cost or the amount of time needed to deliver.

Think of it this way: DND first ordered a Ford Crown Victoria and then, bit by bit, they changed the order to a GT-350. Yeah, it's going to complicate things.

[DerbyX]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Isn't this breech of contract and grounds for us to sue them?

$1:

According to the 2004 contract, DND was supposed to receive the first fully equipped helicopter in 2008.

It would be a breech if Sikorsky failed to deliver the helicopters as they were originally specified. But the deal is in arbitration because as Sikorsky was working on the helicopters the specs the DND wanted kept changing. In any contract when the specs change the due dates go right on out the window.

I don't build helicopters, but I've done plenty of network installs where I give a due date and then someone starts adding to our work orders and I end up over-due and over-budget and it's pretty universal that the clients alwasy think they can make radical changes to their contract and not have it affect the cost or the amount of time needed to deliver.

Think of it this way: DND first ordered a Ford Crown Victoria and then, bit by bit, they changed the order to a GT-350. Yeah, it's going to complicate things.

If they ordered those changes before and Sikorsky couldn't deliver on time b/c of those changes. It might be that Sikorsky said they couldn't deliver the helos as originally specified under the contract (for whatever reason) and then Ottawa demanded an upgraded version if we weren't getting what we want on time.

Seems to me that under the Libs the Sea Kings were an absolute must replacement way back in 93 and now 15 years later Harper decides we can wait at least 4 more years for a slightly better version, one that we might well have been able to upgrade even as we had them in active service?

I think if he did that then its certainly a black mark. Not only are we waiting much longer but paying alot more to and there is no guarentee the price won't go up and the deliver date get pushed back more.

Again I can't help but think that were this reversed and it were the Libs screwing up a CPC purchase that cost us more and delayed vital equipment they would be eviscerated about it.

[uwish]

DerbyX DerbyX:

Isn't this breech of contract and grounds for us to sue them?

$1:

According to the 2004 contract, DND was supposed to receive the first fully equipped helicopter in 2008.

that is exactly what I was thinking. Time to play hard ball...

and Derby I wouldn't go around touting how the sea kings replacement was a 'must' under the liberals. Remember they cancelled their replacement when they formed the next government that cost us $500 million in fees. It is was so important why did they cancel them? and even if they didn't 'like' the 101's they sure were not in any hurry to get another contract, that took another 10 years!

[DoyleG]

uwish uwish:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Isn't this breech of contract and grounds for us to sue them?

$1:

According to the 2004 contract, DND was supposed to receive the first fully equipped helicopter in 2008.

that is exactly what I was thinking. Time to play hard ball...

and Derby I wouldn't go around touting how the sea kings replacement was a 'must' under the liberals. Remember they cancelled their replacement when they formed the next government that cost us $500 million in fees. It is was so important why did they cancel them? and even if they didn't 'like' the 101's they sure were not in any hurry to get another contract, that took another 10 years!

Not to mention that buying the Cyclone seemed to be only done because the Liberals wanted to avoid the EH-101.

[DerbyX]

uwish uwish:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Isn't this breech of contract and grounds for us to sue them?

$1:

According to the 2004 contract, DND was supposed to receive the first fully equipped helicopter in 2008.

that is exactly what I was thinking. Time to play hard ball...

and Derby I wouldn't go around touting how the sea kings replacement was a 'must' under the liberals. Remember they cancelled their replacement when they formed the next government that cost us $500 million in fees. It is was so important why did they cancel them? and even if they didn't 'like' the 101's they sure were not in any hurry to get another contract, that took another 10 years!

If you read carefully you note I said that the people attacking the Liberals for cancelling a "must" buy (and so far every single con supporters deemed the cancellation a scandal) are not attacking the CPC for delaying a purchase that was a "must buy" 15 years ago by 4+ years and costing us another 117 million.

They cancelled the original purchase to save us the 5 billion purchase price not to mention the actual cost of implementation.

Harper had all the money and none of the excuses and so far he keeps costing us money by playing politics. He cancelled the SAR purchase which he then later had to reinstate at an additional cost of 200 million.

Funny how the howls against the military hating Liberals are muted or turned elsewhere when its Harper cancelling purchases, delaying purchases and wasting hundreads of millions of tax payer dollars.

[bootlegga]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Think of it this way: DND first ordered a Ford Crown Victoria and then, bit by bit, they changed the order to a GT-350. Yeah, it's going to complicate things.

Sounds pretty accurate to me. Still, I wish there was some way to hold Sikorsky to task.